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Post by bouncy on Oct 25, 2018 23:49:33 GMT
Ideally, having cages side by side are best for intros. To them, the superior position is the highest, so it immediately causes conflict. Once they're together, there's no reason why you couldn't stack all of the sections, perhaps ditching the stands.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 26, 2018 0:54:24 GMT
If you build a division within the cage, you should make the barrier double thick, even with like a half inch between both "walls" so that toes and tails are protected more effectively. I would also suggest that the half side that has the access to the above section be completely enclosed with the wire, attaching the wire to the sides of the cage, as well as enclosing the front portion where the doors open. This will prevent the acrobatic little mischief from finding a way beyond the central barrier, or from climbing the sides, or jumping down over the edge. They will leave "no stone" unturned in their efforts, so look for all the potential "stones."
As for your space and the set up you have, I'm still looking at your photos and trying to think of options for you.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 26, 2018 1:04:59 GMT
OK . . . this might sound like a really weird idea, but humor me for a moment and see that you think. I could be suggesting an awful lot of work, so just set me straight if I am, OK?
Imagine in the location where the marauders are; the cage that currently holds Fred, Newt and Pickett, but separated, with the support frame from the bottom removed, and sitting side by side.
Next, marauders cage with the wheel/support frame on the bottom also removed, and placed on top of the side by side Fred and Newt/Pickett cages. Making what would look like a cage high rise but would greatly reduce the footprint of all the cages and yet allow for Fred and the boys to be side by side.
Can you picture it? Would it work?
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 26, 2018 16:39:14 GMT
You can make a wooden frame and staple the mesh to both sides to get a double layer of mesh with a gap in between, the solidity of that should make it easier to attach really firmly to the cage.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 26, 2018 22:30:58 GMT
OK . . . this might sound like a really weird idea, but humor me for a moment and see that you think. I could be suggesting an awful lot of work, so just set me straight if I am, OK? Imagine in the location where the marauders are; the cage that currently holds Fred, Newt and Pickett, but separated, with the support frame from the bottom removed, and sitting side by side. Next, marauders cage with the wheel/support frame on the bottom also removed, and placed on top of the side by side Fred and Newt/Pickett cages. Making what would look like a cage high rise but would greatly reduce the footprint of all the cages and yet allow for Fred and the boys to be side by side. Can you picture it? Would it work? So I think that's actually a brilliant idea! I'd been thinking of doing basically that, if I by some miracle was able to get all 6 together. I do have one concern though. The mauraders, 10.5 months, get worked up smelling Fred. I dont even let all three out together because it sets off dominance fights. Thoughts?
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 26, 2018 22:31:41 GMT
Awesome suggestions Molette! I actually have a staple gun, so this may not be too difficult.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 27, 2018 5:59:13 GMT
For free range time, I would have some tall cardboard on hand to basically wrap the bottom cages in to prevent then marauders from seeing them. There is the plastic board that is built like cardboard (I'm sure it has a name, but can't think what it is called) that is harder to destroy than actual cardboard by quite a bit, so you might look for that at Lowes, or Home Depot, or even Michaels. Black is a good color choice for that as well, since the degus just can't fix their eyes on it as well, and they are more likely to believe there is nothing of interest behind it. Or . . . so I hope.
I also tend to think that if the cage you have the marauders in is on top of the other cages, they will not be bothered so much, as they will feel superior due to being higher up, and they won't be able to see them/Fred.
What do you think?
Did I answer your question or completely miss it?
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 27, 2018 20:31:16 GMT
Ok, perfect! I'm definitely going to try that then! It shouldn't be too hard to set up. I think I have wire to keep the mauraders cage together.
I didn't know that about degu eyesight, good to know. I've tries plain cardboard before, but they just want to rearrange everything.
I'll hopefully try this in the next day or so! I'll keep you all updated. Thanks again for the help:)
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 27, 2018 20:33:19 GMT
As thanks, picture of Pickett! Can't remember if I posted this here already or not...
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 28, 2018 21:03:47 GMT
I underestimated how much work this would be. But it's done (for now)!
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 29, 2018 1:00:45 GMT
OOF!! I was only thinking of the cage that Fred and the boys are in being taken apart for side by side, and then the marauders being all one still and sitting on top. I TOTALLY underestimated just how wide those cages are. I'm so sorry, love!! I really didn't imagine it being so massive! The height of them, would have been mind boggling.
How are they doing so far?
Do you have the marauders cages such that they are open to each other?
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 29, 2018 1:23:04 GMT
Oh. Huh. Hahaha, it didn't even occur to me to do it that way! I dont know if I could have made a triple stack, I think I wouldn't have been able to lift it up, honestly, would have been too tall! No worries, I do feel like this was the best option! And now the mauraders have an extended running area. I've heard them going absolutely crazy the past few hours! I think it's ok. Mauraders seem mostly happy, I just need to find a better way to cover the opening to the bottom cages so they really can't see through. Pickett apparently hates vacuums, thank you very much! So hes been very skittish. Good interactions through the bars with Newt, but there was a yelling fest between Pickett and Fred earlier. I made sure to put cloth mesh between their cages, so no tails will accidentally poke through, fingers crossed. Yep, the mauraders have free range of the top level, which they seem to love!
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 29, 2018 2:42:29 GMT
Sounds like a victory to me!! Well done, love!!
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 29, 2018 11:11:18 GMT
Wow! I wasn't really following the rearrangement ideas, are the marauders in the two top sections which are now joined? And Newton, Pickett and Fred are now side by side in the bottoms? If so, that's great Have you got the connecting holes just covered with mesh? You could get some small pieces of sheet metal, maybe from ebay or from an old biscuit tin and screw them on with self tapping screws. See how you get on, but it could solve the vacuum and door opening problem if you could jack the cages back up a little bit. Maybe a big strong sheet of wood, like an old door or heavy bit of plywood sitting on some bricks.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 29, 2018 19:13:26 GMT
Yep, the whole upper section is the marauders and pups and Fred are now side by side! We'll see how they get along. Tensions definitely escalated the past few days between Pickett and Fred.
I was able to fit the cages very close together, but I can see if I can find some thin metal.
I think it's a wonderful idea to raise the cages a bit, but I'm kind of dreading having to do it! I have to go to the hardware store today anyway, I can see if any plywood looks strong enough.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 29, 2018 19:14:12 GMT
Sounds like a victory to me!! Well done, love!! Thank you! Hopefully this will help the intro process along!
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 30, 2018 13:22:30 GMT
I might have misunderstood about the metal sheet, I thought you meant for covering the hole between the top and bottom sections of the cage, but maybe you meant the little gap between left and right.
Are they settling to the changes OK?
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 30, 2018 15:41:35 GMT
Oh, I meant both, sorry! I've got the bottom gap covered with a piece of wood for now, but it's not ideal. Everyone but Pickett seems to be settling in nicely. Newt spent the night with Fred and they both were great. Unfortunately, Pickett is still being pretty skittish. It took about 30min to coax him out for play time last night. He and Fred start fighting as soon as they see each other now.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 30, 2018 16:10:34 GMT
That's too bad, but it is part of the age, as you know. Don't try to rush them along. I know the desire to have them altogether is the end goal, and I know it will be SOOO much better when they finally get there, but one of the things that is really going to help is an older Pickett, which is slow going, LOL. You might have a few months of side by side, sometimes intros, sometimes no intros, ahead of you. It's never a matter of just straightforward progress with fighting and reintegrating. Degus just DON'T believe in that. However, you have arranged their cages and the room in the best way for their future success, and you're doing great!! You really are!
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 30, 2018 16:22:40 GMT
If you think it might help you can put a physical barrier between them over some of the depth of the cage so they only can meet at the shelf level, for example, it the proximity is a bit too much at the moment.
Was the playtime together with all 3, or is there a problem that playtime is up against the outside of the other cage? You could put a cardboard barrier up around the other cage at playtime if being at the same level as the cage is a problem.
You can stop doing meets until they get used to living next to each other and you get better signals between them all now. The idea is that you can read some of the signals between them without them having to meet, or meet so often anyway.
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