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Post by hpdegus on Oct 23, 2018 21:36:43 GMT
Hahaha, the little social climber!
Thanks for the example Deguconvert! That sounds exactly like what Newt did.
Tensions have slightly escalated. Pickett has been running to me whenever he ticks off Fred. I haven't quite figured out the top goo thing. I can keep trying them together, only separate them if it gets bad? Or when they start fighting?
And of course my other group started bickering today...
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Post by bouncy on Oct 24, 2018 0:03:46 GMT
There's something about goos kicking off. Last night, each group was inwardly fighting. It was extraordinary! Alpha goo had to step in to get all three of the big group to back off, and to get Sausagegoo to leave Spud alone and go upstairs. A few hours later, and they're all curled up in their respective piles!
Goos have unpredictable behaviour at the best of times. I sometimes wonder if something like atmospheric pressure changes affect them the way it does my joints?
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 24, 2018 9:50:53 GMT
If tensions are rising and keep rising, you can do fewer or shorter meets, if that feels like a good idea. I can't remember what your housing arrangements are, but having the degus live side by side with a mesh barrier between them can help them get used to each other without any actual risk or contact.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 24, 2018 15:09:35 GMT
Top goo is like mothering toddlers and young children of varying ages. When they fight you walk in, assess the situation to determine what is going on, who is doing what, and then set things moving in the right direction. Sometimes all it takes is a stern look, sometimes, a loud, authoritative "What is going on in here?", and other times a shout over the noise, "IF I HEAR ONE MORE SOUND OUT OF YOU LOT . . .!!" Same with degus only you have to get a little more in their face. Walk quickly to the cage, shout NO!! Wait two seconds . . . no favorable reaction, shout again. Maybe bang the wall, or table, or something beside the cage to emphasize the point. Don't be afraid to blow in their faces, you may need a straw or something that will reach them if they are in the back of the cage. Watch them a few minutes. Leave the room but only hide around a corner, because sure as anything, they will kick off again as soon as they think you are gone. AND there they go!! Back into the room . . . "HEY!! I . . . SAID . . . NO!!" Now . . . when I was learning the top goo attitude, my boys had been separated for 5 months and I was at the end of my rope. I decided that since they just couldn't agree on who would be top goo than I was going to TAKE the position and they would just have to suck it up and adjust. I was feeling my way, but not too sure how to do it. Then I made a mistake, incorrectly identified the boys, and instead of putting the two friends together (I had three boys and one was friends with both, so he would be swapped every two days between the combatants so that no one was alone for too long) I had put the combatants together overnight. That's when suddenly the upstart decided to yield (laying belly up)to the already dominant and all had seemed good for about 2-3 days, but I began to suspect pretty quick that they weren't really settled. Fighting began to kick off again. I was fed up and just started to tell them off and correct them like I did with my kids when they would fight, and low and behold, they were listening. So, think of them as kids that need to be set straight, do this every time you are aware of fighting, and you will will dominant position. They will begin to listen to you and soon you should see better behavior and stronger bonding between them. You may even find they have strong bonds with you. You just need to listen for the slightest indication that something aggressive is afoot and then jump in. LOL, in those days, I spent a lot of time running from one end of the house to the other, keeping kids AND degus in line!! The degus learned faster.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 24, 2018 22:30:32 GMT
For sure Bouncy, so unpredictable some times!
It wouldn't surprise if it did affect them. And the temp has really been dropping here.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 24, 2018 22:34:21 GMT
I've started to switch to shorter meetings, out of pure necessity. At least Newt and Fred are still good together. So I dont have a totally lone goo anymore, which I think really makes Fred happy.
My setup isnt ideal for putting pups and Fred side by side. They're in my room, which is already slightly crowded with two double critter nations. And I dont want to move the pups back to a smaller cage, I think that'd be unfair. I'm open to any suggestions though!
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 24, 2018 22:38:07 GMT
Ohhh, good description Deguconvert! I'll treat them like misbehaving preschoolers. I had some success today by clapping my hands, yelling HEY, and blowing in their faces. The straw is a brilliant idea though! Unfortunately I can't be with them most of the day, but I'm with them after work, so I'll keep a close eye out then.
I'm impressed, that sounds like a ton of running around! I'm tired enough sometimes with just goos acting up!
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 24, 2018 22:40:03 GMT
Would you guys suggest switching Newt between the two fighters? I definitely feel safe with him in either cage. I'm so much more hesitant with them, since they're still pretty young. I dont know if it would help, or hurt the situation.
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Post by bouncy on Oct 24, 2018 23:13:43 GMT
You may find that, if he's been with the pups for a few days, he may be rejected for smelling different?
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 24, 2018 23:45:08 GMT
You may find that, if he's been with the pups for a few days, he may be rejected for smelling different? Sorry, I'm confused, I may have explained it poorly! So Fred is totally alone, so only three goos in the equation. Would Newt (2nd pup) possibly be rejected by Pickett for spending more time with Fred?
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 25, 2018 2:50:00 GMT
It can happen . . . but if Newt and Pickett have a good bond it isn't as big a possibility as you might think. You could try just swapping every 24 hours . . . see how that goes . . . though it could get tiring for Newt. However, I had my two cages side by side, and then the neutral, everybodies friend, goo was able to still see both his friends and they could still see him.
I think I'm not understanding your setup? You have two critter nation cages . . . singles or doubles? The degus are each in one . . . as in Fred in one and Newt and Pickett in the other? They are side by side or stacked?
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 25, 2018 14:11:13 GMT
Sorry, I definitely explained that poorly. My setup: two separate double critter nations. One double holds my other 3 (the mauraders), while the second double is split for pups in bottom, Fred in the top. I dont have a ton of floor space, unless I completely sacrifice their play area. I've attached a photo to give an idea of my setup. Please excuse the mess! If you guys have additional ideas, let me know!
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 25, 2018 15:47:00 GMT
Would you be able to share a couple more photos of the area? Are they in a blocked off area of a larger room, or are they in their own room all together? Would it be treacherous to stand on a chair or something for a higher up photo to get a clearer view of the footprint of the room? Dimensions of the space? I can look up the cage dimensions.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 25, 2018 15:48:02 GMT
I always seem to forget about the "marauders," LOL!
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 25, 2018 17:47:44 GMT
It is possible to add another shelf to the top of the bottom half of the Double Critter Nation and then split that shelf between the groups, so they can meet on the same level. Like this but instead of adding the shelf to the top of the whole unit, add it to the top of the bottom half deguworld.proboards.com/thread/6918/show-cage?page=32 You need to be careful to make it all very secure so that can't get across the divide.
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Post by bouncy on Oct 25, 2018 19:06:29 GMT
Provided you have steps, and you can make the intros work, you can gain floor space by stacking the cage sections to make a tall cage? Steps and ceiling allowing, of course!
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 25, 2018 23:23:10 GMT
So they live in my bedroom, so not much extra floor space for them. I've attached a few more photos. I can try to get dimensions wont be able to for a bit.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 25, 2018 23:25:40 GMT
Thanks for the picture Molette, that's very helpful. I've started the conversion already. I have hardware cloth with 1/2 in spaces that's supposed to be good for small animal enclosures, so I'll try using that. Should I do a double barricade? In the picture below, the opening between the two cages is on the back right corner. I'm imagining a mesh barricade dividing the top level in half.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 25, 2018 23:27:19 GMT
Bouncy, do intros work as well with stacked cages? My cages are currently stacked, which really does help with floor space. I dont know if I can unstack them in any configuration and still be able to let them out in my room.
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 25, 2018 23:35:49 GMT
Actually was able to find a tape measure, the dimensions are: 4 feet 8in by 7ft 2in. I can maybe push that a few in each side if necessary.
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