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Post by dyzired on Jun 18, 2011 14:57:34 GMT
Lol there are no vets here that know anything about degus. I could see how far away the closest exotics vet is.. But who knows if they have experience with degus either. Ill try again after this weekend. Unfortunately i wont be able to get him in until monday at the earliest.
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Post by moletteuk on Jun 18, 2011 16:50:33 GMT
I'm glad Moose is on the mend If he continues to improve, I'd just give him some Benebac, keep an eye on him and keep him at home for a few days, I'm not sure what else the vet could do. I *think* what Smux is getting at is that eating poop from a healthy degu could help populate Moose's gut with 'friendly' bacteria. Now that Dyzired has some Benebac, which is a probiotic for small animals, this is probably a safer way of helping Moose. (I do know of a case of a hamster with life threatening, severe constipation, and the owner gave the hamster a poop from their healthy rabbit, which was enough to get the hamster's gut working again. I have to say she was desperate and her dad was a vet though.) I thought coprophagia in degus was a double digestion technique to extract maximum nutrients from food.
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Post by fred on Jun 18, 2011 17:25:52 GMT
I thought coprophagia in degus was a double digestion technique to extract maximum nutrients from food. That's exactly what it is – nothing to do with immunity. I agree there is probably little a vet could do at the moment, I only suggested it as a potential source of information as far as the possible of poo feeding are concerned. I understand the idea of “friendly” bacteria but there is a huge difference between Yakult and degu droppings. The production of Yakult is controlled so that there are no “bad” bacteria in it. The same can not be said about degu droppings. That is also the reason why it is not possible to “limit” the intake – it is not the number of dropping which is relevant but what is in them.
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Post by deguconvert on Jun 18, 2011 19:10:22 GMT
Hey Fred . . . I don't particularly think it will supply him with antibodies, and I realize I have implied that. I am thinking more along the lines of the healthy gut bacteria that are contained in the poo, and thinking that he may need a broader "selection" of such bacteria than what he may have on his own. These are things that he would have come across living with his parents and their poos (DO degus eat each others poo as well as their own???), I am assuming, and so was wondering if he would perhaps benefit his gut conditions by having some other poo to choose from.
I'm sorry, I am laughing because I can't believe I am suggesting let alone discussing this on the forum!!! ROTFL!!! And yet . . . I am seriously wondering if it would benefit him. Does this ring a little more sensical, Fred?
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Post by deguconvert on Jun 18, 2011 19:16:34 GMT
If that is what the "bene . . . gut stuff" does, then by all means stick with that. It is not a product that I am familiar with, so had little idea what it's purpose was. I would rather err on the side of caution then to promote something that could be a hazard for little Moose. I have kind of been assuming that Moose would have an inner instinct at to which particular "poo" to choose for ingestion, however . . . that may well not be the case. Keep up with the Benebac I think!
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Post by fred on Jun 18, 2011 22:56:22 GMT
@ deguconvert – I became concerned about this issue because Moose falling ill followed not only the discussed treats but also his visit to the sanctuary. I have of course no evidence that his illness is related to the latter but a priori it is equally likely. Therefore my advice would be not to take him there before he his fully recovered. IF germs for which he did not have any antibodies were the cause of his illness, then there would be a significant risk that more of those could be brought in with Rocket's droppings. On the other hand, from all that is known about degu biology I cannot see any potential benefit at this moment in time. From a risk / benefit analysis perspective, the advice must clearly be against.
@ smux – I am sorry but you keep confusing different issues. Picking quotes from different sites without understanding the context is not helpful. Since the health of a degu may depend on the advice given here, I find this quite irresponsible.
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Post by dyzired on Jun 19, 2011 1:28:01 GMT
Lol sooooo many worddss!!! Idk whose to follow haha dont mean to laugh but this is quite entertaining to see everyone going at it .i appreciate all the concern and effert with figuring out whts wrong with my baby.
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Post by deguconvert on Jun 19, 2011 5:22:15 GMT
Alright gentlemen, about face and square off at 20 paces. The first to present a 1000 word paper following a comprehensive laboratory study on the complete breakdown of degu milk and mother poo, will be deemed . . . over dedicated. Dyzired, I still think that the Benebac is best to follow at this point. I do think he would benefit from the bacteria that would be found in the poo of healthy degus from the sanctuary, but regardless of what I think, you are his "mom" and must decide according to the best information you have. Sometimes that means you wait and see how he does. I'm shrugging. Whatever comes about, I do most sincerely hope for his growth, long life, and full and vigorous good health!
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Post by dyzired on Jun 19, 2011 10:39:20 GMT
Thank you for now ill go with benebac... And once i get him and rocket together for good, he can eat all the poo his little heart desires
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Post by fred on Jun 19, 2011 10:44:32 GMT
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Post by dyzired on Jun 20, 2011 2:26:38 GMT
Moose isnt doing well again... Hes in my hands again..and hes falling asleep while eating...he definitely dropped weight...could it be diabetes?
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Post by dyzired on Jun 20, 2011 2:53:29 GMT
Soo i just noticed when he pooped that there was blood in it :/ let me know what u guys think
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Post by fred on Jun 20, 2011 7:00:55 GMT
I am so sorry to hear that he isn't doing well. You really need to get him to a vet (any vet!) as quick as you can. We all would like to help but there are some things one just can't do long distance.
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Post by lollie24 on Jun 20, 2011 17:15:22 GMT
poor moose I do hope he gets better soon, would it be possible to get him to the vet for the shelter?? were really lucky as our vet has a degu herself so hopefully understands what they need. reading what was said about degu poo and the stuff you got him I think it would be best to keep him on that for now. now I know this may rile a few of you on here but I used to breed Siamese mice and I had 3 of my mice get very ill I tried everything including taking to the vet and as a very last resort and the vets suggestion and after two of the three dying I put a droplet of brandy into the remaining mouse's water, when I checked on him in the morning he was like a new mouse, and he lived till 5 yrs old which is two years longer than normal for a mouse. I'm not suggesting you do this but it sounds like the peanut butter someone suggested earlier may be worth trying next wishing moose a speedy recovery
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Post by deguconvert on Jun 20, 2011 18:52:06 GMT
VET!!! He may need antibiotics or something . . . there is definitely something wrong in his gut and you need to have him seen. Doesn't the Sanctuary have a vet that works with it?
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Post by moletteuk on Jun 20, 2011 19:32:42 GMT
and fluids with the syringe like you did before. Hang in there Moose x
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Post by dyzired on Jun 20, 2011 21:11:17 GMT
Just got an appointment with the vet for tomorrow at 3.. He looks so horrible. Hes soo skinny. It happened so fast. I know the vet has never seen a degu before.. But i do know a tech over there mentioned she had three so hopefully she'll be there. They said they can do some blood tests on him and ill bring a feces sample in for them to test. God i just hope he makes it until tomorrow. ( my poor baby. I feel like its my fault..
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Post by sophie9901 on Jun 20, 2011 21:26:41 GMT
I hope little moose hangs on in there, I'm really sorry to hear he's so sick!! I'll be thinking of him x
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Post by moletteuk on Jun 21, 2011 18:49:24 GMT
How's he doing?
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Post by dyzired on Jun 21, 2011 19:39:33 GMT
He didnt look that horrible this morning.. But im at the vet right now and hes got no energy at all.. Hes soo weak.. The vet said possibly parasites... :/ they rlly dont know anything about degus...the vet researched as much as she could so she knows the basics.. But idk.. Ughh
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