Post by saggy on Sept 7, 2022 2:07:19 GMT
Hi Lovely People
I know I haven't been on here for ages but the last unexplained death really got to me due to how it happened etc etc - but thanks for all your help in the past regardless. My two remaining Degus have stayed in good health but have needed to add more ramps because they won't jump as far etc but expected of old age and both still running a lot - in fact Fatsy's lost weight and not so fat because she did start running quite a bit in her later years - go figure! Fatsy's vision is questionable also but seemingly not too much an issue.
I had another problem come up and just not sure what is to be expected.
My runty degu called "little one" was a little ostracised from her original family and is socially awkward and cannot tolerate humans apart from me. Will take a special treat from my daughter sometimes and run off but that is the extent at which she'll go. She's fine with me though and will stack up on me for cuddles etc. My other one Fatsy is very food orientated and will go up to anyone and do anything for food! I don't think anything could traumatise Fatsy as she honestly doesn't care about much lol.
Anyway, Little one suddenly had what I hoped just to be a cyst in June but I also kinda knew it was a tumour also. She is 7.5 and with this in mind and because of the way she is with people, I figured the chances of her surviving any op if the stress didn't kill her first was slim - she's never been seen by the vets because of it. They once looked into the back of the cage at her when the other two were pulled out but left it at that not to stress her unecessarily. I regret leaving it now but she seemed completely herself and not bothered by it at all so figured leaving it was the best course of action and let it run it's course. She's always been a bit of a running wheel fiend as her way to de-stress and the lump was above her arm so she was a little bit frustrated at this but ate, behaved and did everything else normally. Then, it just kinda grew and grew, then while I went on holiday for two weeks, it doubled in size. The person coming round to feed them didn't see it though as she won't come out for strangers generally. I saw it when I got back although she was still mostly herself but it took ages to get appointments etc and I couldn't find anything with someone who dealt with exotics never mind degus near by (refuse to take her to petsathome) and it doubled in size again last week. She then took the decision to chew it off herself so became urgent and had to just see anyone. They said it was probably best to put her down but could also try sugery although very high risk and unlikely to survive and weight had dropped to 190 - she's always been small but not this skinny. However, I felt I had to give it a shot because she had to go through the stress of being handled whether it was to be put down or put under for op. It took a while to even get a surgical slot as everywhere just too busy so she lost a bit of blood the past couple of weeks (she rushes to lick the blood back up so assuming she's low on iron and ears have gone pale) and I stayed up with her a number of nights just to stop her chewing herself - the metacam helped but just when it wore off. It was pretty grusome by the end and probably twice the size of her head. I would add a photo but it might actually be a bit too disturbing to look at to be honest - it was horrific and was that big and long that it touched the floor (started at the shoulder) and ended up being about an inch or maybe 1.5 inches in diameter.
Anyway, she had the surgery today and she surprisingly pulled through. she was there a total of 1.5 hours and I had waited briefly in a quiet room with her until the moment they put her under due to her higher than norm nervousnous. She was okay when just with me at that point - very stressed but still running all over me if no one else there. She was under for about 15 mins but she nearly died towards the end of it as her heart dropped suddenly and they just had to do a rushed and messy stich job while pulling her out of anaesthetic as they had to get her off asap - I just hope she didn't come round too quick at this point and wasn't aware. I took her home half hour later at 2pm as they knew it was better in her case not to stay too long even though she hadn't quite come round properly as there would be no way of knowing whether she was still struggling from effects of anaesthtic or whether frozen/heart rate bad from being terrified. They did tell me that unexpectedly, there was a large cyst under the tumour and they suggested perhaps maybe her body had tried to seperate the tumour from body with the cyst as they hadn't quite come across that before. Other than the cyst beneath popping and flooding everywhere as they accidentally cut into not realising it was there, they said the tumour was unexpectedly a piece of cake to remove - nothing was attached to anything and just enough skin to stich back up where it had stretched.
The first half hour on the drive home, she was pretty groggy and just wouldn't budge from her corner looking away from me at the wall and was obviously still a little wobbly - she didn't even want comfort from me which is unusual but figured normal when you're coming round confused at what the hell just happened. I expected her to be sleepy rest of the day or hide in her den or out of sight maybe even chirping alerts like she does when she's scared but since she got back, she's staying in one spot in the cage, not even that hidden on full alert on a cold hard shelf in a very sat up position - paws almost not touching floor (considering she's now half naked on one side of her body, I would have thought she'd have gone in nest for warmth). Not sleepy or resting at all, not even hiding down a corner, just full alert in the same spot literally like a statue not really doing anything and it's now gone 2am? I put a tea towel in that spot thinking maybe she'd rest on something soft but she just decided to partially put her front paws on it and stayed in the same upright position. SHe's come away from there a couple of times and I thought oh that's okay now but after few minutes, goes back there. She's not really eating properly neither. I managed to get her to eat a few oats, a few buckwheat flakes and a few quinoa flakes (not normal diet, just has no interest in normal food right now so anthing to tempt her) and she nibbled on a small bit of chocory root and had a a couple of seeds but she even dropped half the root and left it which she wouldn't normally do. Wouldn't touch the sugar snap pea which she would normally run for. THe few times she has moved, eaten, her movement was fine, not unbalanced - in fact she bolted far faster than she could before and then she jumped on me twice for very short minute and then back to her spot. Just after two minutes - back to statue.
She won't drink anything. Actually, scrap that, literally as I wrote that, she finally just went to the water bottle for a couple of seconds then back to statue on shelf lol!!!
She's not in as much pain neither I don't think as apart from scratching with her back leg a little irritably at the stiches, she's not trying to gnaw on it any longer. I think the remaining skin and the way it's been stitched is probably somewhat tight, not quite in the right place for her arm, and uncomfortable but I don't think you can expect much better with the size of tumour they removed and the speed at which they had to get the stiches done. Not looking to cuddle Fatsy for comfort neither. Showing no signs of going to bed anytime soon!
So just a couple of questions as a little concerned:
I know she probably had a very high level of adrenalin today so do you think it's just taking it's time to go back down because she's a particularly stressy animal and today was probably the most traumatic thing ever for her nature? (Fatsy literally had bone sticking out her finger after a fight in the early days alongside other nasty wounds and and as long as she had a bit of food in her gob, she will put up with vet prodding/touching her broken hand or picking her up etc etc even though she's rather not be there so the complete opposite). Is there any other reason they might act like a statue for 12 hours or more apart from a few minutes here and there???
When should I start worrying about her not eating properly - I'm aware of gut stasis but she's nibbled on a few bits for 30 seconds at a time and the vet said she definately pooed a couple of times after the surgery when she was still wrapped up?
Do I need to be concerned about her scratching in that non careful fast back foot way they do at her stiches - will they hold if she keeps doing this?
How quickly do their teeth grow too long to sort themselves? She hasn't been chewing on wood etc the past few weeks due to the pain she's in I imagine and can see maybe a slight problem there. Do you think that they won't be too long for her to get back down herself if she starts feeling better and chewing properly again soon?
They're keeping the tumour for 10 days for me while I decide whether or not to pay the additional £200 for the testing how bad a tumour it was and the level of how much might be left on remaining skin or the margins they called it (single working mum so surgery cost already hard to swallow). They said it won't really change future treatment options for a degu and it's a case of if it grows back, same choice on the table but would it help in anyway that I can't think of right now? I'm assuming because of how aggressive it was and the way it looked, scabbed and different textures of it, it probably isn't going to come back with good news so would be the margins of any real use at this point in time?
If any of you have any experience, any help would be gratefully received.
Thanks in advance, Sarah
(Apologies for the essay, just figured better for you to have all the details)
I know I haven't been on here for ages but the last unexplained death really got to me due to how it happened etc etc - but thanks for all your help in the past regardless. My two remaining Degus have stayed in good health but have needed to add more ramps because they won't jump as far etc but expected of old age and both still running a lot - in fact Fatsy's lost weight and not so fat because she did start running quite a bit in her later years - go figure! Fatsy's vision is questionable also but seemingly not too much an issue.
I had another problem come up and just not sure what is to be expected.
My runty degu called "little one" was a little ostracised from her original family and is socially awkward and cannot tolerate humans apart from me. Will take a special treat from my daughter sometimes and run off but that is the extent at which she'll go. She's fine with me though and will stack up on me for cuddles etc. My other one Fatsy is very food orientated and will go up to anyone and do anything for food! I don't think anything could traumatise Fatsy as she honestly doesn't care about much lol.
Anyway, Little one suddenly had what I hoped just to be a cyst in June but I also kinda knew it was a tumour also. She is 7.5 and with this in mind and because of the way she is with people, I figured the chances of her surviving any op if the stress didn't kill her first was slim - she's never been seen by the vets because of it. They once looked into the back of the cage at her when the other two were pulled out but left it at that not to stress her unecessarily. I regret leaving it now but she seemed completely herself and not bothered by it at all so figured leaving it was the best course of action and let it run it's course. She's always been a bit of a running wheel fiend as her way to de-stress and the lump was above her arm so she was a little bit frustrated at this but ate, behaved and did everything else normally. Then, it just kinda grew and grew, then while I went on holiday for two weeks, it doubled in size. The person coming round to feed them didn't see it though as she won't come out for strangers generally. I saw it when I got back although she was still mostly herself but it took ages to get appointments etc and I couldn't find anything with someone who dealt with exotics never mind degus near by (refuse to take her to petsathome) and it doubled in size again last week. She then took the decision to chew it off herself so became urgent and had to just see anyone. They said it was probably best to put her down but could also try sugery although very high risk and unlikely to survive and weight had dropped to 190 - she's always been small but not this skinny. However, I felt I had to give it a shot because she had to go through the stress of being handled whether it was to be put down or put under for op. It took a while to even get a surgical slot as everywhere just too busy so she lost a bit of blood the past couple of weeks (she rushes to lick the blood back up so assuming she's low on iron and ears have gone pale) and I stayed up with her a number of nights just to stop her chewing herself - the metacam helped but just when it wore off. It was pretty grusome by the end and probably twice the size of her head. I would add a photo but it might actually be a bit too disturbing to look at to be honest - it was horrific and was that big and long that it touched the floor (started at the shoulder) and ended up being about an inch or maybe 1.5 inches in diameter.
Anyway, she had the surgery today and she surprisingly pulled through. she was there a total of 1.5 hours and I had waited briefly in a quiet room with her until the moment they put her under due to her higher than norm nervousnous. She was okay when just with me at that point - very stressed but still running all over me if no one else there. She was under for about 15 mins but she nearly died towards the end of it as her heart dropped suddenly and they just had to do a rushed and messy stich job while pulling her out of anaesthetic as they had to get her off asap - I just hope she didn't come round too quick at this point and wasn't aware. I took her home half hour later at 2pm as they knew it was better in her case not to stay too long even though she hadn't quite come round properly as there would be no way of knowing whether she was still struggling from effects of anaesthtic or whether frozen/heart rate bad from being terrified. They did tell me that unexpectedly, there was a large cyst under the tumour and they suggested perhaps maybe her body had tried to seperate the tumour from body with the cyst as they hadn't quite come across that before. Other than the cyst beneath popping and flooding everywhere as they accidentally cut into not realising it was there, they said the tumour was unexpectedly a piece of cake to remove - nothing was attached to anything and just enough skin to stich back up where it had stretched.
The first half hour on the drive home, she was pretty groggy and just wouldn't budge from her corner looking away from me at the wall and was obviously still a little wobbly - she didn't even want comfort from me which is unusual but figured normal when you're coming round confused at what the hell just happened. I expected her to be sleepy rest of the day or hide in her den or out of sight maybe even chirping alerts like she does when she's scared but since she got back, she's staying in one spot in the cage, not even that hidden on full alert on a cold hard shelf in a very sat up position - paws almost not touching floor (considering she's now half naked on one side of her body, I would have thought she'd have gone in nest for warmth). Not sleepy or resting at all, not even hiding down a corner, just full alert in the same spot literally like a statue not really doing anything and it's now gone 2am? I put a tea towel in that spot thinking maybe she'd rest on something soft but she just decided to partially put her front paws on it and stayed in the same upright position. SHe's come away from there a couple of times and I thought oh that's okay now but after few minutes, goes back there. She's not really eating properly neither. I managed to get her to eat a few oats, a few buckwheat flakes and a few quinoa flakes (not normal diet, just has no interest in normal food right now so anthing to tempt her) and she nibbled on a small bit of chocory root and had a a couple of seeds but she even dropped half the root and left it which she wouldn't normally do. Wouldn't touch the sugar snap pea which she would normally run for. THe few times she has moved, eaten, her movement was fine, not unbalanced - in fact she bolted far faster than she could before and then she jumped on me twice for very short minute and then back to her spot. Just after two minutes - back to statue.
She won't drink anything. Actually, scrap that, literally as I wrote that, she finally just went to the water bottle for a couple of seconds then back to statue on shelf lol!!!
She's not in as much pain neither I don't think as apart from scratching with her back leg a little irritably at the stiches, she's not trying to gnaw on it any longer. I think the remaining skin and the way it's been stitched is probably somewhat tight, not quite in the right place for her arm, and uncomfortable but I don't think you can expect much better with the size of tumour they removed and the speed at which they had to get the stiches done. Not looking to cuddle Fatsy for comfort neither. Showing no signs of going to bed anytime soon!
So just a couple of questions as a little concerned:
I know she probably had a very high level of adrenalin today so do you think it's just taking it's time to go back down because she's a particularly stressy animal and today was probably the most traumatic thing ever for her nature? (Fatsy literally had bone sticking out her finger after a fight in the early days alongside other nasty wounds and and as long as she had a bit of food in her gob, she will put up with vet prodding/touching her broken hand or picking her up etc etc even though she's rather not be there so the complete opposite). Is there any other reason they might act like a statue for 12 hours or more apart from a few minutes here and there???
When should I start worrying about her not eating properly - I'm aware of gut stasis but she's nibbled on a few bits for 30 seconds at a time and the vet said she definately pooed a couple of times after the surgery when she was still wrapped up?
Do I need to be concerned about her scratching in that non careful fast back foot way they do at her stiches - will they hold if she keeps doing this?
How quickly do their teeth grow too long to sort themselves? She hasn't been chewing on wood etc the past few weeks due to the pain she's in I imagine and can see maybe a slight problem there. Do you think that they won't be too long for her to get back down herself if she starts feeling better and chewing properly again soon?
They're keeping the tumour for 10 days for me while I decide whether or not to pay the additional £200 for the testing how bad a tumour it was and the level of how much might be left on remaining skin or the margins they called it (single working mum so surgery cost already hard to swallow). They said it won't really change future treatment options for a degu and it's a case of if it grows back, same choice on the table but would it help in anyway that I can't think of right now? I'm assuming because of how aggressive it was and the way it looked, scabbed and different textures of it, it probably isn't going to come back with good news so would be the margins of any real use at this point in time?
If any of you have any experience, any help would be gratefully received.
Thanks in advance, Sarah
(Apologies for the essay, just figured better for you to have all the details)