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Post by teemu on Mar 6, 2022 15:57:08 GMT
instead of critical care, how about vegetable only baby food or oatmeal made really mushy? Something that gets nutrition and water into her, and tastes good enough that she likes it. Quality of nutrition is less important than just keeping her going. I wonder if she maybe cracked a molar or two by getting her jaw/head slammed down, so you can't detect the problem and it seems like everything works, until she tries to actually use her teeth? I've tried those as well, but she seems unintrested in everything. Both sweet potato baby food (the only one with no milk or animal protein or berries I could find) or soft and nice oatmeal have gotten no response at all. And I can't really leave them in the cage with her because Limppu will just scarf everything down like the little food vacuum she is.
I am feeding her by hand though, so she is getting fluid and some food in her. It's not optimal at all, but we can hold out for now if there is need.
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Post by winic1 on Mar 6, 2022 16:09:47 GMT
Poor Suti!
When I had a critically ill degu, I ground his favorite seeds into a fine powder, then mixed that up with liquid to get him to eat. Gradually mixed some critical care and other stuff into it to make it healthier. Fed it to him on a tiny tiny spoon, right through the bars so he wasn't stressed by handling. Would distract the other two degus in the cage by giving them their forage in another part of the cage.
I know you're probably trying all of this, but I'm hoping that maybe there's something helpful in what I wrote.
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Post by teemu on Mar 6, 2022 17:24:09 GMT
Poor Suti! When I had a critically ill degu, I ground his favorite seeds into a fine powder, then mixed that up with liquid to get him to eat. Gradually mixed some critical care and other stuff into it to make it healthier. Fed it to him on a tiny tiny spoon, right through the bars so he wasn't stressed by handling. Would distract the other two degus in the cage by giving them their forage in another part of the cage. I know you're probably trying all of this, but I'm hoping that maybe there's something helpful in what I wrote. I actually tried that too, and it's no good. She was curious and inspected it, but seemed to just be totally incapable of eating any. I think her mouth hurts really bad... The painkillers have helped a bit, though. She's more active and less sullen. It's a small blessing. I'll have to force-feed her soon again.
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Post by moletteuk on Mar 6, 2022 17:30:54 GMT
I would top up the metacam to a full drop if you think she may be in significant pain. I think you can go up to 3 drops of dog strength if really required and with vet supervision.
Do you think you can get her to the vet tomorrow?
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Post by hpdegus on Mar 6, 2022 17:31:15 GMT
Can you try giving her the other 2/3 of the metacam dose? Maybe in just water, or very liquidy baby food, if she'll take either?
Sorry for the double post Molette!
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Post by teemu on Mar 6, 2022 19:37:09 GMT
Yeah, I gave her the rest of the Metacam dose (in CC, since I had to get some food into her in any case). She certainly has more energy now, even though she really does not like it. She's been trying to eat pellets and hay, but I don't think she's actually getting anything in.
Her overall condition does not seem to be getting any worse, at least, which is certainly a relief. If this was something life-threatening, I'm fairly certain it would start showing already. Instead, she's very mobile and resists medication and feeding with very energetically.
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Post by teemu on Mar 7, 2022 1:00:12 GMT
For a relief, she seems to take just fluid rather well. She doesn't want anything in her mouth, but when I held her mouth up, I could drop water from the syringe in there and she would drink it without a fuss. Anything thicker than water is likely going to cause issues, but I have at least managed to keep her hydrated this way, and she has gotten CC multiple times today, and I mixed crushed seeds into the last batch. It's not a lot at once, but at least her belly keeps working).
Running low on CC, so I think I will use the baby food next. I am hoping that I'll be able to get her a vet appointment tomorrow. I will call them the first thing in the morning, as soon as they open up. Suti's condition is stable, but as she's still having trouble eating, she really does need to get looked at as soon as possible.
The Metacam has really perked her up. She prefers to huddle with Limppu, but I even saw her walking in the wheel for a bit in the evening. So she is certainly not getting any worse. Her tail tip might be, though. It looks like she's picked at it. The break is a nasty extra she's having to deal with.
Still, if all this can be put away with just a broken tail tip and some damaged teeth that can be dealt with (really hoping they can be...), I will be very relieved. This really is one of those nightmare scenarios I'm always really afraid of. I am not a small man at all, and these are such quick and fragile animals. I've always been mindful, with all small pets I've had, and this was genuinely the first time it has happened in all my 16 or so years of keeping rodents. I'm hoping it will also absolutely be the last...
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Post by teemu on Mar 7, 2022 9:29:34 GMT
Could not get a vet appointment before wednesday. They were totally full and very apologetic about how they had no times available at all. And I know from experience that there are no other vets anywhere even remotely close who even could inspect a degu's mouth. I first found this one when I was originally looking for a vet to do a dental checkup on Pulla way back when, and I went through a good number before I foound this one.
We'll just have to tough it out until then, it seems. 2 more days. Suti seems to be a bit less pained this morning, but she still isn't eating (despite trying to, the poor thing). I'll do my best to keep her fed and hydrated.
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Post by teemu on Mar 7, 2022 9:57:59 GMT
Success! Finally found some way to get her to eat without having to cram the syringe in her mouth. After finally tasting the sweet potato baby food from the syringe, she started to hungrily teeth at it, and I could just keep pushing some out for her to lick up. I think she was rather hungry and all. So I managed to feed him a good amount of the baby food, and she also drinks water from the syringe without a fuss.
She still won't really even look twice at anything offered on a spoon or otherwise. I think there's too much pain, so that she won't start eating without being prompted to. But we've found some way to cooperate now, and that's really good going forward.
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Post by teemu on Mar 7, 2022 13:48:35 GMT
She's actually starting to eat again! It's very little, but she has eaten a sunflower seed and a food pellet while I was observing her. Very slowly, but it seems to be getting a bit easier. She also seems to be able to eat small amounts of rice-corn cakes (the dry stuff that's made from puffed rice and corn). Probably because it's so brittle that she can bite into it easily.
She has also looked a lot less pained than yesterday (though part of that is likely the metacam). Things are certainly looking up.
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Post by moletteuk on Mar 7, 2022 15:46:03 GMT
At least getting to Wednesday and the vet doesn't seem too bad if she is eating a little for herself and you have come to a mutually approved arrangement for the soft food.
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Post by teemu on Mar 7, 2022 16:13:55 GMT
Yes, it's looking a whole lot more feasible now. She is actually looking increasingly perky. I'm almost suspecting that it might be a wound that she got, possibly from her teeth pushing into the roof of her mouth or something like that. Mouth wounds heal quickly, so it would make sense that she's already getting back to it. Still, she has an appointment for the wednesday, and the vet is obviously taking it seriously. I'll be dropping her off in the morning, and they'll X-ray her head and body to make sure there's nothing wrong and will sedate her so they can do a dental inspection. I'm so glad that this seems to be way less serious than I initially feared
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Post by teemu on Mar 8, 2022 15:11:30 GMT
Suti is behaving almost normally now. She's jumping around, going about all active, not huddling nearly as much and does not appear to be in any great amount of pain (even though I have not given her metacam today). Her eating is still slow and tentative, but she grabs pieces of rice cake very greedily and I have seen her rummaging around in the hay a lot, so likely she is feeling a lot better about eating.
I've still given her some extra food and fluid with the syringe, and I absolutely will take her to see the vet tomorrow, but it's really looking like we got off very easy this time.
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Post by teemu on Mar 9, 2022 11:40:31 GMT
Suti has now been checked, and she has a fracture in the back of the lower jaw. They can't really do much about it, but the prognosis for natural healing is good. She'll be eating soft food and getting metacam for some time, but she should get over this just fine They said that this may lead to teeth problems in the future since it may cause an uneven bite, but we'll worry about that if it comes to it. For now, there's nothing life-threatening or debilitating happening in there and things are looking up.
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Post by savvy on Mar 9, 2022 12:08:41 GMT
Phew! Glad its nothing too serious.
She got off really lightly, but I still think you're going to have to spoil her rotten to make it up to her.
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Post by deguconvert on Mar 9, 2022 20:57:45 GMT
I did wonder if there might be a fracture in the lower jaw. That would indeed make it impossible to chew. Had she been in the wild and her jaw was fractured, she might well perish from it because getting food would be impossible for her. It is a blessing she is in your home and being cared for in such a way that her body is still getting nutrition as well as pain relief!
So glad she has been seen and you know exactly what is going on, and that things are indeed looking up.
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Post by teemu on Mar 9, 2022 22:09:25 GMT
The fracture is fortunately very slight, they said they could only barely see it in the X-ray. The integrity is fortunately there, so she is actually capable of chewing and everything, but it just hurts and she doesn't want to do it. She has started nibbling on hay again, though, so that is very good She really does not like CC. She took the baby food pretty amicably, but I got a new pack of Critical Care from the vet, and she absolutely wants nothing to do with the stuff. We have to butt heads a bit about it, since the CC would really do a lot more good to her than the baby food. She needs to get some nutrients in her, since going hungry or malnourished now would be really bad...
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Post by deguconvert on Mar 9, 2022 22:50:50 GMT
Will she take the baby food with a tiny bit of CC in it?
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Post by teemu on Mar 10, 2022 0:04:55 GMT
Yeah, seems like the CC goes down a lot smoother when there's baby food in it to mask the taste. I guess it's not even bad for her as such; the baby food has essentially no sugar at all (it's another kind, just mashed root vegetables and the like, has something like 1% sugar content in it), so I don't mind doing it if it helps her. I also crushed in some peanuts to help her get some calories and all that in her. It's strange how she doesn't actually resist eating it after we get down to it and I hold her up and put the syringe to her mouth, but she really does not want to eat otherwise.
I've also been giving her water with the syringe. I think she's probably capable of drinking on her own, but it certainly won't hurt when she's like this. At least until I clearly see her drinking from the bottle, I will keep giving her water after meals. She doesn't really resist the water either, so it's likely doing her good as well.
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Post by moletteuk on Mar 10, 2022 10:17:52 GMT
You might be able to get CC in a different flavour, although I'm not certain the product is exactly the same, there is a fine grind version and a banana one too. Supreme pet foods also make a similar product called Recovery Plus.
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