M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93 
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Post by M&P on Oct 20, 2020 16:42:53 GMT
So it’s been a while since I’ve posted on here. We recently adopted 2 new degus to keep our lone degu company. Our original boy, Pippin, is around 5 years old and our 2 new degus, Jasper and Smudge are around 4 years old. As far as we were made aware Jasper and Smudge have always been bonded. Things are going alright. It’s been around 3 weeks since the Jasper and Smudge’s arrival and they are settling in with one exception. We’ve recently started trying playtime out of the cage for them. This is something our original boys always had but we’re not sure if Jasper and Smudge ever had before. Whenever we put them in the playpen they squabble. It’s always resolved but it’s starting to make me question whether to keep going with playtime. Should I let them settle a little more in their cage first? The other thing is that our lone degu Pippin also has playtime in there at other times so could that be causing the fights between Jasper and Smudge? Any advice would be much appreciated  |
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 20, 2020 16:45:22 GMT
Also should just mention that when they’re in the cage they don’t really fight. It’s very peaceful. We have the aventura large cage for them which is set up next to Pippins cage (also the aventura). The cages are about 10cm apart as they like to stick their tails out between the bars.
When they’re in the pen it’s silent fighting. Thumping tails, flinging at each other the like. I keep a close eye on them for the ball and for biting but they haven’t so far. I don’t stop fights unless it comes to those two extremes.
I only started with playtime around 4 nights ago. So that’s 4 playtimes so far. The fighting has happened the last 2 times they’ve been out.
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Post by winic1 on Oct 20, 2020 18:58:29 GMT
How long have you had them?
The playpen area is a whole new 'turf' for them to claim dominance over. And it smells like another male degu, which means there is a rival for both this new area AND for dominance overall. This is probably setting off the fighting.
Since you haven't had them very long yet, they may still be feeling a little insecure about their new territory, even if they appear to be comfortable in their cage. Adding a huge territory with the scent of another degu may just be a bit too much for them, just yet.
I think maybe you should hold off on letting them have out of cage playtime just yet. And when you do, maybe start small, block off just a small area out of their cage and restrict them to that until they are comfortable being out of cage. Once they are happy with that, then expand their area so they can adjust to it without being overwhelmed by a gigantic new experience all at once.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 20, 2020 20:12:55 GMT
The thing with new territory is that it contains none of the usual scent cues that are present in their cage. Do you use a substrate in their cage? I think that keeping them from time outside is one thing you can do. Another thing would be to take some handfuls of their substrate and spread it in the play area to see if that will help. THOUGH having had two nights of fighting now . . . they may just go to the fighting again and ignore the scented material that reminds them of their bonded relationship.
It might not hurt to try it though. IF you don't mind the mess. Which you could sweep up after and return to the cage.
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Post by bouncy on Oct 20, 2020 20:13:29 GMT
Ditto Winic! What you're describing is that of goos trying to establish who's boss. Adding a new area with a more dominant scent will just cause ructions, especially as they don't really know who the scent belongs to.
By all means, let Pippin continue his playtime, but wait until they're all in the same cage before you let them all out.
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 21, 2020 7:02:35 GMT
Thanks guys! We’ll give them a long break from time out of the cage for now.
Next time we try we’ll sprinkle their substrate first and see how it goes.
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 21, 2020 15:39:17 GMT
Also, just as an afterthought, has anyone got any advice on a biting degu?
Smudge one of our new boys is blind in one eye and has a cataract in the other. He’s pretty much blind as a bat! He’s taken to nibbling our hands and fingers. He’s quite happy to come out onto our hands (unlike his brother Jasper who’s a bit more timid) and we don’t mind him nibbling but sometimes it’s too hard. We’ve tried loudly squeaking at him but he just looks at us with a confused expression.
He drew blood from me once (might have been my fault as I was reaching over him to put hay in the cage and I must have upset him) I squealed loudly at him and blew a little puff of air at him. Don’t really want to be doing that all the time though I hate doing it! I only do it during the severe, aggressive times.
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Post by winic1 on Oct 21, 2020 16:07:03 GMT
I would bet that the hard bite was a result of him being surprised by the sudden presence of your hand. Even with a cataract, he will have some vision, it will be blurry, it may just look like light and dark shadow vision. Best solution for this situation is just make sure he has fair warning that your hand is approaching, talk to him as you move your hand in the cage, tap the floor with it as you move it along, so that he can tell that it's you there, and doesn't suddenly detect SOMETHING IS APPROACHING and strike in fear and self-defense.
As for the nibbling too hard, continue with the squeaking. Doesn't necessarily have to be loud, just make sure it sounds distressed and alarmed, he will learn to get the message. If he goes back for a second nibble, squeal again and put him down. He will learn that he loses hand privilege if he doesn't keep gentle.
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 21, 2020 16:48:37 GMT
Yeah the bad bite was definitely due to being startled. Even still it wasn’t as bad as it could be. It drew blood but it could have been a much deeper bite. It seemed like more of a scared/warning bite. Thanks. Will keep going with the squeaks/squeals. He seems really confident on hands but I just worry he’s going to bite too hard again! In contrast his brother Jasper is really timid on hands. We’ve been training him with occasional treats but don’t want to force him out of his comfort zone. He much prefers legs to hands |
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 21, 2020 21:30:36 GMT
I have a rescue that came to me with cataracts in both eyes as well! Though he doesn't seem nearly as friendly as yours I hum or sing whenever I'm near them or even in the room. I think it really has helped him, though apparently I tend to sing one song when getting ready to hand out meds, so he runs off when he hears that. About the fighting only in the play area, I've also had issues with that. Making sure they have separate play areas has been huge. It can be as little as a foot away from your lone boys play space, but a floor space on which they can't smell him should be helpful. If you don't have the floor space to accommodate that, play time in a bath tub worked for me. |
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 22, 2020 9:10:29 GMT
Last night Smudge was getting really antsy (we think he realised he wasn’t getting time out of the cage and acting out) so I opened the bottom door and sat on a chair next to the ledges.
He loved it! He was running out onto my legs, climbing up to my shoulders, touching his nose to mine, and pulling on my trouser leg to try and get me? my pj bottoms? into the cage!
We had a few firm nips to our hands which got a distressed squeak in return and he seemed to get the message. He was quite gentle after that. He’s such a friendly boy!
Now the only issue is he likes to bite the bars on the bottom ledge at the door to let me know he wants leg time 😅
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 22, 2020 9:11:32 GMT
I have a rescue that came to me with cataracts in both eyes as well! Though he doesn't seem nearly as friendly as yours I hum or sing whenever I'm near them or even in the room. I think it really has helped him, though apparently I tend to sing one song when getting ready to hand out meds, so he runs off when he hears that. About the fighting only in the play area, I've also had issues with that. Making sure they have separate play areas has been huge. It can be as little as a foot away from your lone boys play space, but a floor space on which they can't smell him should be helpful. If you don't have the floor space to accommodate that, play time in a bath tub worked for me. That is so funny! Time to find a new song for medicine time 😅 Right now it looks like I’m the play area! As I write this I have two degus crawling all over me! |
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 22, 2020 12:15:18 GMT
Awwww, adorable! Such a friendly boy. Pics? |
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 22, 2020 13:53:59 GMT
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Post by hpdegus on Oct 22, 2020 14:01:29 GMT
Love love love the pictures of the new boys on the snugglesafe! And Jaspers leg hanging out of the cage--hilarious! Pippin looks like such a sweetheart cuddled up with your shoulder |
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 22, 2020 14:11:10 GMT
Love love love the pictures of the new boys on the snugglesafe! And Jaspers leg hanging out of the cage--hilarious! Pippin looks like such a sweetheart cuddled up with your shoulder Jasper certainly is a character! He can’t seem to sleep unless his legs are sprawled everywhere. Yes, Pippin is a little cutie! We’ve had him with us for over 4 years and he’s definitely bonded to us. He’s been a lone degu since January this year. Hopefully he’ll be able to pile with some new friends soon. He’s started sleeping up against the bars on their side so that’s a good sign at least. We don’t expect miracles though. We tried bonding degus before and it’s tough going! |
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M&P
Foraging Degu
Posts: 93
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Post by M&P on Oct 22, 2020 14:22:56 GMT
I just realised hpdegus, I was reading your thread the other day about your boys fighting. Hope everything has blown over with that now and they’re getting on!
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Post by moletteuk on Oct 22, 2020 16:45:26 GMT
What glorious photos, they really topped my heart up today, thank you. I love the heatpad on top of the house in the lookout position, what could be better for degus! And you finding ways to befriend them and spend time with them to suit their preferences is lovely, fingers crossed you'll have a happy group of three soon.
Hopefully the squeak will be enough to convey the message when a nibble hurts, but don't worry too much if you need to blow in the face too, after the first couple of times it never startles them as much again.
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Post by deguconvert on Oct 22, 2020 17:32:14 GMT
Those are absolutely AWESOME photos! I love, love, love them as well! I also love your descriptions of them, and couldn't help thinking that they could easily be followed by "Is looking for a like minded female degu with a bright and sassy personality!" DeguWorld Degu Dating App  I also love the rather unique behavioral quirk of Jasper, that his legs and tail must be through the bars!! I literally LOLed! Thank you for the second shot that shows both feet. That one is priceless! Your boys clearly know they are loved and are fully at ease in your home. LOVELY |
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Post by bouncy on Oct 22, 2020 17:40:51 GMT
I LOVE the sprawl, followed by the leg spread to take up the space that Jasper has just vacated!
How long do you have to stand next to the cage so Pippin doesn't fall out when he's asleep?
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