How long do degus grieve for?

[SillyDegu]

One of my degus died 1.5 weeks ago and I can't find anywhere that says how long I should let his brother grieve before trying to introduce him to a new friend. Can anyone help me out please?

[deguconvert]

It is very dependant upon each individual degu. Some recover very quickly and some do not. It depends on the depth of their attachment and the personality of the remaining degu(s). Do you see any signs of lethargy, lack of interest in food, or disinterest in toys or other things that usually occupy his attention? If not, then he may be open to meeting someone new. I say "may" because some degus are doing fine, not deeply grieved, after a companion passes, but are not so recovered that they welcome someone new. Also, you need to understand that introductions are seldom quick and without bumps or complexities. They often take a lot longer than anticipated and can last anywhere from weeks to months.

[SillyDegu]

Thanks for your reply :-) Tobias seems to be doing quite well, he's still eating and active. The only change is that he's more interested in getting attention from me. He's 4 years and 4 months old, his brother's death was unexpected and sudden (complications from anaesthetic), they had lived together all their lives and were pretty inseparable.

I've attempted introductions before (I've since realised that they were at the wrong age when I tried), I was thinking of getting some pups as it sounds as though those introductions go a little more smoothly. I just want to make sure I don't rush things with Tobias.

[Karma]

My Einstein barely grieved at all - I allowed him to sniff his brother once he passed and he was much quieter for a few days but acted normal. I found once a degu is older and alone they are much easier to introduce.

I tried for 4 months to introduce aslan (3) to my two 4 year old degus and finally gave up after a tail, toe and multiple bloody messes. Einstein was the one that hated him. Got a youngish boy to partner with the lone aslan - one 5 minute meeting in a play pen and then later in the day in the same cage and ZERO problems. They were both alone so enjoyed the company.

Then Herc died and I almost didn't try introductions because of the experience before .... left Einstein alone for about two weeks (the other two wee across the room from him) ... only because of my timing and busy life. It took 3 visits I think before I attempted them in the same cage. ZERO problems and they are still extremely stable group months later.

Proof that even though they hated each other before, they can change. I would either try to find a single male around the same age or do the two babies so they would have someone to play with (although I wonder if the babies would be super bonded and still leave the older one out on his own). Good luck

[SillyDegu]

Tobias' behaviour still hasn't really changed, it's been two weeks now so maybe he just isn't going to grieve? I have another degu (Daniel) who is living on his own after he fell out with his group last year (the usual scrapping turned in to fighting and I unfortunately had to separate him for his safety), I've been working on reintroducing them but with no luck so far. I was going to try him with Tobias but wasn't holding out much hope as I've tried to introduce them before but they hated each other. That was 3 years ago and your story gives me a little more hope that maybe they will be happy living together. I don't know exactly how old Daniel is as he and his friends were rescue degus, I've had him for 3 years so he's definitely not going through puberty. I swapped some of their bedding yesterday and neither of them starting acting aggressively or barking so I going to move the cages in to the same room today and go from there. Fingers crossed!

[deguconvert]

I think this is definitely an idea worth trying. I hope it goes really well!!

[moletteuk]

The grieving seems to vary a lot, my girls grieved for months and months, Tobias sounds OK to me and trying him with Daniel sounds like a great idea.

[SillyDegu]

I moved Daniel's cage in to Tobias' room on Sunday and I've been swapping a bit more bedding between the two. Tobias mostly seems curious and as though he might be willing to accept Daniel, however Daniel is acting very aggressively. There's been a lot of teeth chattering and Daniel keeps trying to bite Tobias through the bars (they haven't been in direct contact yet, just through the cage bars when one of them is out of his cage for a run), he managed to draw some blood when he bit Tobias' tail.

I know that introductions take time but I'm wondering whether it's going to be possible to introduce them at all considering Daniel was originally separated from his group for fighting and is now acting very aggressively.

[moletteuk]

I don't think you have anything to lose by leaving their cages near to each other for a couple of weeks and see if you get any reduction in aggression. I would go slower and stop swapping substrate for now, and move the cages a little bit further apart and see if Daniel calms down at all.

[deguconvert]

Ditto

[SillyDegu]

Unfortunately Daniel's aggression hasn't reduced, he managed to bite Tobias through the cage bars and break his finger. I'm afraid that there will be further severe injuries if I keep trying to introduce them. Daniel's cage has been moved back in to the room with the other three degus, none of whom he's ever tried to bite. I've read that pups aged 6-8 weeks are easier to introduce, I've been keeping an eye out for anyone rehoming male pups and trying to find a breeder. Does anyone know of a breeder around Yorkshire? I'm not sure how long a car journey degus would tolerate so I'm hoping to find some within a two hour drive, does that sound reasonable?

Thank you to everyone for your advice so far, it's disappointing that it hasn't worked out.

[deguconvert]

Degu introductions take a lot of time. It is easily three months for "quick" intros, generally speaking, and twice that length at least for many. They need to have lots of time to adjust to, and accept, each other. This can mean two months of the cages being within 4-7 cm of each other. If there is aggression it is not surprising. If toes are being hurt, then the cages need to be pulled apart enough that nothing from the other cage can be reached. Sometimes the difference of an additional couple of cm is amazing! Once there is calm between the cages, at that point face to face can be done. I wouldn't give up on them yet.

As for intros of young pups to others being easier . . . that is a matter of debate. While it can go quicker and easier initially, you will not likely have smooth seas for long. All degus go through an adolescent period that can start as early as 5 months of age, and can last right up to 18 months age. They will begin to compete and then fight for dominance rights, and even though they seemed well settled and happy, their hormones will drive them into a red rage that even they do not understand, but find themselves helpless to resist. This can be a very intense and tumultuous time for degus and most especially for their humans. It is not unusual that separations occur, sometimes for months at a time, and reintroducing is then required.

If I were you, I would stick with the two you are working with for a while yet.

[SillyDegu]

The cages were about a foot apart, the injury happened while one of them was out of his cage for a run, so I would need to cover the bottom few inches of each cage with something so that they can't get at each other at all. I'll have a think about what you've said, I just want to do what's best for them. Daniel is such a sweetheart with humans but isn't getting on with other degus.

[deguconvert]

He may need a longer grieving period. He may get along with only one of the other three and hate the remaining two, or he might eventually enjoy all three, but it could take a long time with that as well.

Introductions have prominent themes that we capitalize on, and use for methods, to help people through, but there isn't a singular method that works with each and every degu. It has to be tweaked, and shifted, and rewound, and frequently examined so as to fit it to the individuals involved in each intro. The better you know your degus, the more accurate will be your interpretations of what you are seeing. There are the basics that we can get . . . but the finer dialog is always somewhat unique to each degu.

[deguconvert]

OH . . . and for the running time, yeah, something that can cover the sides to prevent them from running on top of each other's cage would be a really good idea.