NEED SOME ADVICE PLEASE

[fb1928]

Some of you may of seen my previous thread about us starting to introduce rescue Patchy to our Chewy and Chuckie... Well we have had a massive change in dynamics.

Chuckie been testing Chewy loads for about the last month, we have seen a lot of dominating, minor fights and minor aggression.

Yesterday I was working so my partner was in charge of looking after the goos... When I got home late yesterday evening he told me he had to separate Chewy and Chuckie as they started fighting badly and Chuckie got Chewy in a FBOD! Chewy was injured (He has two bad bites on his neck).

Well when I looked in the cage to check on Chrwy, I saw something remarkable... Chewy and Patchy snuggling on the bed together and happily grooming each other!!!

Well my OH didn't realised that I had swapped Patchy over into the top half of the other cage as I was making some edits to the bottom and as Patchy was hiding in his bed when all the noise he didn't see him so just chucked Chewy in there thinking that part was empty!

We tried placing Chewy and Chuckie in the box in neutral territory Chuckie just tried to kill him straight away - and as they got on so well we put Chewy and Patchy back in together, I know that is a unorthodox thing to do and very risky and many other Degu owners out there wont agree with our decision but its was we felt was best. Chewy was very weak and needed someone there to cuddle and clean his wounds.

Today Patchy and Chewy have been getting on amazingly... They have been cuddling, happily chatting to each other, playing together - I have never heard so many happy chirps and warbling before, especially from Patchy.

So our problem is now what to do, as Chewy and Patchy have built a good bond we don't want to take that away but Chuckie is now on his own... Should we try and re-introduce him but really worried about doing this? Find Chuckie another companion? Or any other ideas please?

Sorry for the long essay... Just needed to explain it all fully - thank you in advance for your help.

[Deleted]

Hello! Please don't panic, it sounds awfully scary but as long as the wounds are just superficial Chewy will be fine, especially if he stays on good terms with his new pal!

It may have been the aggravating factor was Chuckie, and that Chewy never had a problem with Patchy at all.

I've just put degus together before who didn't know each other and it stayed on good terms for a good few weeks until dominance fighting started.

I would leave things as they are. But keep an eye on Chewy and Patchy, Chewy might possibly not be fighting because he knows he's injured, which is fine, as long as they're being watched generally speaking.

Keep Chuckie alone, don't try any reintroductions again yet. Wait until everyone has healed, forgiven and forgotten before thinking about some more introductions.

Keep swapping dirty substrate and sand baths over daily.

[fb1928]

Obviously we will keep an eye on Chewy and Patchy...as I know this behaviour could change very quickly but all the signs of a secure relationship seem to be showing and don't want to take this away... Just really unsure what the best thing to do is.

[bouncy]

I would have done exactly the same. Patchy is obviously looking after him, and you haven't seen any signs of hostile action between them. I personally think it might be worth keeping the arrangement for a week or so, not letting Chuckie and Chewy see each other. This gives healing and cooling off time.

[bouncy]

Afterthought - patchy is the same sex as Chewy and Chuckie?

[fb1928]

Thank you emily for replying.

His wounds are looking much bette today, Patchy looks like he has helped clean them up nicely. Think it was just scary as my OH said Chewy went all limp and wouldn't eat or drink. But after some TLC and cuddles from my partner he started eating normally and seems to be back to his normally self today apart from being a bit tired after a busy day yesterday. Just been being over protective.

That's true, when thinking about it after a few days Chewy kept going over and happily warbling at Patchy but Chuckie would stay away and just watch.

That's what I am concerned about, will the relationship change in a week or so. Don't want to end up with three lonely goo's hopefully they will be able to sort it out peacefully.

We sure will, my partner is working night shifts the next few weeks so he can watch them during the day when I'm at work and then I can watch them in the evening when he is at work - and as they are in the sitting room they can be watch constantly, the only time they wont be watched is during the night but should be okay as they will be sleeping.

Okay. That's what we were waiting for, so once everyone is healed and calmed down in a few weeks do you think a reintroduction could work?

Thanks for the advise about swapping the dirty substance. I'll do that daily.

[fb1928]

Thank you bouncy. No we haven't seen anything aggressive at the moment. Okay, they are currently in separate places in the sitting room and can only see each other if they both stand on the top shelf, is this okay or do you think we need to move Chuckie to the other room so he can't see then at all?

[Deleted]

fb1928 I would double check the sex of Patchy as bouncy has said. Females and males notoriously get along better than same sex groups (in terms of quickness), for obvious reasons LOL.

Yeah just let everyone calm down, recover and have time to forgive eachother... perhaps make it so they can't see eachother for now (unsure of your setup I can't visualise it) or can see less of eachother (piece of cardboard between two pieces of mesh maybe) so you can see how Chuckie reacts to being alone and how Chewy and Patchy get on. Then once everyone seems 100% themselves, remove the cardboard and start again..

I wouldn't do any face to face open air introductions until you're hearing 98% happy sounds.

[Deleted]

Or at least ignoring eachother totally with occasional happy sounds (this may indicate they aren't fussed either way about each others presence).

[fb1928]

Yes, Patchy is 100% male, we checks that before even bringing him home... Especially as we adopted him from p@h, don't want that surprise again.

[bouncy]

You don't need to move him to a different room

[fb1928]

Lol, don't worry that was the first thing I checked when we thought about adopting Patchy... Don't need another 16 pups again! Never trust p@h.

Ok. Thanks. Well our set up is made of the tall two Blenheim cages bolted together to form one cage, Chewy and Patchy are currently in. We then have another cage which is similar to the Liberta Explorer and Chuckie is in this. So it is possible to move one of the cages onto the bedroom for the time being but then would this be removing our neutral territory that we will need for reintroductions.

We definitely won't be rushing into the introductions until Patchy and Chewy relationship is sorted.

I really wish I could speak Degu then I could just find out what is going on and talk to them.

[fb1928]

Thank you bouncy. Just wanted to be sure the I'm doing the best thing for them.

[fb1928]

Chewy and Patchy have just started boxing each other... Chewy is boxing then spinning around the try and kick Patchy with his back legs. Patchy has tried doing this a few times but Chewy is doing it more... I'm concerned as Patchy has been pushed back in the bars several times now. There is also some loud tooth clattering happening. Should I separate them? I don't want any more injury's especially as Chewy is already hurt.

[bouncy]

My two youngest pups (brothers) have always done this, and still do it every time they come out. One year on I keep waiting for one of them to moan about landing their flying roundhouse against the kitchen units, but it doesn't bother them. It's natural behaviour, so don't worry

[fb1928]

Ok. Glad this is normal behaviour. It just looks so rough, they have calmed a bit now and are eating.

[moletteuk]

What a shocker!

How were Chewy and Chuckie before? How well suited and settled were they?


I don't think there are any rights and wrongs, I hear your doubts about Chewy and Patchy and think they are probably valid. I think ultimately if you want all 3 together then it's Chuckie and Patchy that need to come to terms with each other and so allowing Chewy to jump ship like this might not help the overall cause. I honestly don't know what I would do.

[fb1928]

It sure was moletteuk.

Chewy and Chuckie have never been a problem. We started bonding Chewy with his son when Chuckie was only 4 weeks old as we wanted him to move straight from Mum to living with Chewy and this introduction went without a problem and at 6 weeks old they lived together in peace.

They have always been very close but since Chuckie got to about 18months old he has shown more of an interest in being the alpha. This was only ever a little bit of mounting nothing like what happened the other day. But this last month he has been mounting more and I noticed on several occasions Chewy letting Chuckie mount him but I think Chewy has changed his mind and Chuckie wasn't happy.

I know neither do we, that's why thought I would ask on here for other people's opinions to work out the best solution.

At the moment we are thinking of keeping Patchy and Chewy together and keep an eye on their relationship, hopefully if it continues to go well once everything has calmed down and injury healed we will try and reintroduced with Chuckie... We really want them all to live together no matter how long it takes. So just looking at all information I can find on reintroductions as that is new to us.

[bouncy]

Ah, so Chuckie is at that teenage stage?

[fb1928]

bouncy

Chuckie turned 2yrs on the 3rd August. I did originally think it maybe its teenage stage but I thought that only normally last until they were about 18mth old... Could he still be going through teenage stage at 2. He was born a few weeks premature so don't know whether this would mean he would develop in this stage later? . When our other boys got to about 9months they went through teenage years but this then stopped when they were about 16months.