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Post by titchycatnipsandwich on Apr 18, 2017 13:21:03 GMT
So, I'm curious to try and get some information from everyone on the forum about occasions when your degu has bitten you, and if there are any provoking factors that are common to them biting us. It doesn't seem to happen often, but a degu bite can damage the trust between human and degu, and can make new owners wary of handling their pets.
For the purpose of this survey, I'm defining bites as:
Nip: skin not broken. Minor bruising may occur, but infrequently. This is the kind of "bite" you'd get from a goo who was grooming you and got carried away.
Minor bite: skin breaks, but no bleeding occurs (think paper cut - fairly shallow) or if there is bleeding, it self-terminates in a by short space of time. The kind of bite you get if you startle a wary degu and they are warning you to knock it off already.
Major bite: skin breaks, lots of blood. Doesn't have to be floods, but the kind where you have to apply pressure to make it stop. The kind of bite you get if you stick your hand in the middle of a FBOD.
Serious bite: a major bite that results in you needing to seek medical attention for infection or significant physical damage. I guess minor bites could also qualify on the infection front, so I'll include those here too, but I suspect they're a lot less common.
I'm hoping to collate the results into Excel to create pretty graphs and see if we can come to any conclusions. Please answer each question as clearly as you can. I may be able to use the freeform answers as well if I get enough responses, so give as much detail as you're comfortable and able to.
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)?
Answer in years and months:
How many degus have you had in that time?
Answer:
(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.)
Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for
Degu years:
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus?
Yes/No
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
Yes/No
If yes, please provide further detail:
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes/No
If yes, can you recall how many?
In the last 12 months only:
How many times have you been bitten by a degu?
Answer:
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
(X) minor / (X) major / (X) serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?)
Answer:
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)?
Answer:
Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language)
Answer:
Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?)
Answer:
How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works?
Answer:
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2017 14:46:33 GMT
How long have you owned degus?
Answer in years and months: 14 months.
How many degus have you had in that time?
Answer: 5.
(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.)
Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for
Degu years: 14 months.
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus?
Yes
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
Yes
If yes, please provide further detail:
All bar Pickle are from Pets at Home. Pinky and Perky are my first two whom I just bought from there. Poppy was there too, being bullied so I took her. Pickle was from a litter of babies dumped at a vet so her history is unknown. Kev is from P@H adoption centre, had his partner Keith sold and took away from him. Unknown about his past history.
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes
If yes, can you recall how many?
1
In the last 12 months only: 1
How many times have you been bitten by a degu?
Answer: between 10-15 times.
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
14 minor / 1 major / 0 serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?)
Answer: startled, in the process of an introduction, boxing was happening in a small space so I scooped her up to remove her.
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)?
Answer: yes.
Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language)
Answer: No.
Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?)
Answer: Not really. The situation itself is explanatory; but she's never bitten us to the point of serious bleeding before.
How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works?
Answer: hasn't affected it at all. They're prey animals so of course they're going to bite first in panic and ask questions later! I love them to bits. However, it does put my boyfriend off as he's been bitten more, and they hiss and growl at him as a warning.
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Post by titchycatnipsandwich on Apr 18, 2017 18:11:45 GMT
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)?
Answer in years and months:
3 years 1 month
How many degus have you had in that time?
Answer:
5
(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.)
Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for
Degu years:
5 degus x 3 years 1 month = 15y 3m degu-years
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus?
Yes
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
Yes
If yes, please provide further detail:
Degu 1 - lone male degu for ~9 months, attempting to reintroduce to the original male pair that he was separated from..
Degu 2 - young female degu, living in a large mixed sex group due to accidental population explosion, reasonably degu-socialised but poorly human-socialised.
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes
If yes, can you recall how many?
One - separating a FBOD, degu bite caused cellulitis in the bitten area.
In the last 12 months only:
How many times have you been bitten by a degu?
Answer:
3
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
2 minor / 1 major / 0 serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?)
Answer:
Zoe had two abscesses on the jawline which required daily burritoing to clean and disinfect. Zoe tolerated this for the most part, but would nip if I was too rough with the cotton buds. The major bite came when he slipped out of the burrito mid-filling-the-abscess-with-honey-via-syringe and the syringe bumped into the open wound. I suspect this hurt an awful lot, as he screamed and bit my thumb.
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)?
Answer:
No
Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language)
Answer:
Not on that specific occasion, but there were plenty of nips over the preceding weeks that made the actual bite not-unexpected and explained why it happened.
Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?)
Answer:
Zoe had been nipping my finger if I was too rough with the cleaning in the preceding weeks, so while it was still a surprise it shouldn't have been unexpected.
How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works?
Answer:
It made me more careful about tucking paws into a burrito before starting abscess-cleaning, and for about a week after I was a bit twitchy any time any of the degus went near my fingers. I guess I got a little insight into their fight/flight/bite reflex when something causes them pain. But I couldn't bring myself to blame him for biting me, as I'm pretty sure if I had a painful open wound and someone poked it (even by accident) I'd probably have a good go at hitting/lashing out at them.
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Post by uglibug on Apr 18, 2017 22:03:20 GMT
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)?
Answer in years and months:
5 years 2 months
How many degus have you had in that time?
Answer:8
(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.)
Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for
Degu years:
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus?
Yes
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
Yes
If yes, please provide further detail:
Bought from pets at home as a baby, always lived with sisters.
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes
If yes, can you recall how many?
1. During a house move. I got impatient trying to get her into the carry case and grasped her from above. She sunk her teeth through my thumb to the bone. Caused massive infection, 4 weeks of antibiotics and painkillers. Still have scars.
In the last 12 months only:
How many times have you been bitten by a degu?
Answer:
3
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
3 minor / 0 major / 0 serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?)
Answer:
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)?
Answer:
Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language)
Answer:
Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?)
Answer:
How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works?
Answer:
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 19, 2017 19:41:14 GMT
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)?
Answer in years and months: 6yrs
How many degus have you had in that time?
Answer: 3 most of the time
(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.)
Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for
Degu years: 18
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus?
Yes
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
Yes
If yes, please provide further detail:
Good history, born at an acquantance's house, well cared for there and subsequently with me.
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes
If yes, can you recall how many?
Loads of grooming nips, but I let them do it and deliberately offer my hand for bonding purposes
Maybe 6 to 10 intentional bites that were very minor, just breaking the skin and intended by the degu as a warning.
In the last 12 months only:
How many times have you been bitten by a degu?
Can't remember any recently, other than invited grooming nips.
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
0 minor / (0) major / (0) serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?)
Answer:
I have had one major bite ever, and that was when I was restraining a degu to medicate and feed her and she had a serious skeletal issue and it was causing her pain. During the same course of treatment over 6 weeks, she also bit Ian twice in one session. My bite was pretty sore and throbbing for a few days and healed in a week or so, Ian's oosed and got a little bit infected but he didn't get treatment and it healed in 10 days or so.
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)?
Answer: no
Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language)
Answer:
Not really any specific warning for the big bites, but she was obviously hating being restrained and wasn't in a position to give many signs.
All other minor but intentional bites have always had warning signs, usually adopting a posture primed for alertness and then a pounce ready posture, sometimes growling. Sometimes I see tail wiggling and feet stamping as a warning.
Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?)
Answer:
The minor bites are usually expected after the first say 6 months of living with the degus and learning what weird things they hate. So Molly would pounce if I used a cloth right in front of her. Flossie pounces if I mess with stuff in her territory that she doesn't think I should be messing with. Sometimes the pounce won't actually include a bite. Usually the reasons are stupid and baffling, but it's their territory so their rules. I wonder if the weirdness of the degu's preferences leads some people to not notice that some things are winding their goos up.
How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works?
Answer:
I try to respect their boundaries and try to respect their wishes within their territory. So if they don't like me sweeping or wiping with a cloth right in front of them I try to avoid this if possible. Flossie sometimes doesn't like me messing with substrate, so if this can't be avoided when she is around I do it slowly and let her see what I am doing to try to keep her calm as I do it.
I think degus are exceedingly well controlled with their teeth. When my degus have done very sudden and fast pounces, they are normally doing it for shock effect and the teeth barely break the skin, if at all. I think the grooming nips are entirely optional, they don't bother me at all. I don't blame Molly at all for the deliberate deep bite, she was in pain, it wan't her fault at all. (I did wear a leather glove on the hand holding her while I fed her after that, but I didn't fear her, it just took that tentativeness away that makes you clumsy).
There is another class of bite that is really cheeky, but again purposely designed to get your attention but nothing more than that and not painful. Flossie once bit me on my big toe to get me to move it. It was enough to startle me and make me move it but not painful. Also Molly would climb on top of the digging box while I was sat on the floor, so she was at shoulder/ raised arm level. She would then tug on my sleeve trying to persuade me to feed her treats before the others, and if I didn't comply fast enough, she would occasionnaly tug on my skin, again, barely really a bite, no harm done, just enough to get my attention. Both of those nips I thought were a bit cheeky so I would tell them off for those. Alice has never bitten anyone in any form.
I want to say again not just how skilled they are with their teeth, but also how in control of their behaviour they are and how well they know how much damage the exact level of tooth pressure will do. It's incredible how they can move so fast to pounce but not really break the skin, or with the attention seaking bites, Molly would pull on the skin quite hard but not break it. In my opinion they are just using their teeth as a way to communicate, it's not aggressive. I also trust my degus to groom my eyelashes with their teeth and have done so several times, I have complete faith that they mean well and just never do unpredictable things. Their body langauage communication skills are amazing. I can tell what my degus are thinking in a way I never could with my dwarf hamsters.
Oh, another thing, I've taken each of the degus to the vet several times and they always need restraining there for examination and they aren't routinely restrained at home so they aren't used to it. In all those times they have never bitten us or the vet.
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Post by randomname on Apr 20, 2017 12:51:40 GMT
So, I'm curious to try and get some information from everyone on the forum about occasions when your degu has bitten you, and if there are any provoking factors that are common to them biting us. It doesn't seem to happen often, but a degu bite can damage the trust between human and degu, and can make new owners wary of handling their pets. For the purpose of this survey, I'm defining bites as: Nip: skin not broken. Minor bruising may occur, but infrequently. This is the kind of "bite" you'd get from a goo who was grooming you and got carried away. Minor bite: skin breaks, but no bleeding occurs (think paper cut - fairly shallow) or if there is bleeding, it self-terminates in a by short space of time. The kind of bite you get if you startle a wary degu and they are warning you to knock it off already. Major bite: skin breaks, lots of blood. Doesn't have to be floods, but the kind where you have to apply pressure to make it stop. The kind of bite you get if you stick your hand in the middle of a FBOD. Serious bite: a major bite that results in you needing to seek medical attention for infection or significant physical damage. I guess minor bites could also qualify on the infection front, so I'll include those here too, but I suspect they're a lot less common. I'm hoping to collate the results into Excel to create pretty graphs and see if we can come to any conclusions. Please answer each question as clearly as you can. I may be able to use the freeform answers as well if I get enough responses, so give as much detail as you're comfortable and able to.
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)? Answer in years and months: Around 7 years totalHow many degus have you had in that time? 9.Answer:(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.) Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for Degu years:
63.Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus? Yes/No
yes,once.
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?) Yes/No YesIf yes, please provide further detail: Mid level status & age in a colony of 5. Was adopted via RSPCA as a hoarding case. Bite was NOT his fault in any way.Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus? Yes/No YesIf yes, can you recall how many? OneIn the last 12 months only:How many times have you been bitten by a degu? Answer: NoneApproximately how many of those were minor/major/serious? The bite I had years ago was pretty major. It bled like crazy & was right in the webbing between my thumb & forefinger, you could clearly see the two holes where the teeth bit in, top & bottom of my hand, another centimetre & it would've gone right through. Pain was immense & it took a few hours to stop bleeding. I cleaned it with TCP & bandaged, was fine but sore the next day. No infection thank goodness. Thinking about it, I would've taken the kids to the doctors if they'd been bitten like that, so I probably should've gone myself. It did heal pretty quickly. (X) minor / (X) major / (X) serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?) Answer: Was my fault entirely, I picked him up during a FBOD. I thought I was rescuing him as he was being picked on, but he didn't see it like that! I learned a huge lesson about thinking through the situation a little before rushing in to rescue animals or people. Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)? Answer: No.Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language) Answer: NoWas it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?) Answer: No unless you count with hindsight! I would never pick up a degu barehanded when they're fighting ever again. Can't believe I was so stupid to be honest.How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works? Answer: We were fine after a couple of days. They were never the most handle-able colony as I did not do much training, but they were friendly & took food & strokes. He was fine with me straight after (& my bellowing stopped them fighting) but I was wary for a day or two. Once I realised he was ok with me, I forgot about it. Hope that's ok? |
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Post by titchycatnipsandwich on Apr 20, 2017 18:50:10 GMT
That's brilliant, thanks  Thank you all for responding |
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Post by Maravilla on Apr 21, 2017 20:45:02 GMT
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)?
Answer in years and months: 7 years, 6 months
How many degus have you had in that time?
Answer: 25
(If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.)
Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for
Degu years: 187,5 years
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus? yes
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
not many details about their past known
If yes, please provide further detail:
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes
If yes, can you recall how many? 1
In the last 12 months only: none
How many times have you been bitten by a degu?
Answer:
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
(a couple of times) minor / (1) major / (1) serious
For those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?)
Answer: major: I really can't remember; serious: I held the degu, my partner treated a wound; I got bitten 3 times within a few seconds in the fingertip and finger joint
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)?
Answer: no
Did the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language)
Answer: no, not really
Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?)
Answer: in some way, yes, as it was a very scared degu and a special situation, and I did not use either gloves or a towel to hold the degu
How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works?
Answer: it is now my partner that holds the degus in such a situation and I treat them
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Post by fb1928 on May 19, 2017 16:45:36 GMT
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)? Answer in years and months: 3 Years & 4 MonthsHow many degus have you had in that time? 22 Degus (If you are able to calculate your degu-years total, please insert it here. This is only a rough estimation.) Degu years = how many degus you have had x how long you have had them for Degu years: 22 degus x 3 years 4 months = 66 years & 88 months (7 years & 4 months)
= 73 years & 4 months - degu-yearsHave you ever been bitten by one of your degus? Yes - Once by a 7 month old maleDo you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?) YesIf yes, please provide further detail: The male was born in our home, the son of our male and one of our female Degus - Got bitten when intervened during a fight between him and one of his brothers. No history of abuse or neglect as was in our care from day 1. Socialised with other Degus from moment he was born and human interaction from day 1.
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus? No
If yes, can you recall how many? N/AIn the last 12 months only: N/AAnswer: Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious? ( 2) minor / ( 1) major / ( 0) serious - Minors just cause by over-grooming, Literally only a nipFor those bites which were major or serious, was there a reason for the degu to bite you? (this would include breaking up a FBOD, taking away food, the degu was startled, the degu was injured or unwell, and many more. Basically, can you think of any reasons why the degu bit you?) Got bitten when intervened during a fight between him and one of his brothers when trying to separate them. Don't think we was trying to bite me but got in hand in the way when he tried to bite his brother and he managed to catch the side of my hand where there was no towel.
Were you in the process of introducing the degu to another (group of) degu(s)? NoDid the degu warn you before they bit you? (Growling, a less-serious bite/nip first, body language) Not exactly - Was in middle of fight so was displaying fighting behaviour towards the other Degu, Don't believe this was aimed at me. Behaviour included loud squeaks, thumbing tail, lunging towards the other Degu.Was it expected? (Does the degu have any history of biting in that situation, is the degu normally bite-y towards other degus?) No, No history of fighting or biting. This major fight occurred only once and two other minor fights when they were transitioning into 'teenagers' and testing their dominance. Once dominance hierarchy re-established fighting stopped. How did it affect your relationship with your degu - has it made you less trusting of holding them/offering them treats with your fingers? Did you gain a little insight into the way your degu's brain works? Answer: Did not affect my relationship with my Degu at all. It was an accident and only happened due to a heat of moment fight, I believe biting me was a complete accident as he is a very caring and gentle Degu, only occured due to re-establishing hierarchy. I just learnt to make sure my hands and arms where completely covered before stopping another Degu fight.
Hope my answers have been helpful |
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Post by klbishop on May 20, 2017 13:11:38 GMT
How long have you been a degu owner (in total)? 8 years
How many degus have you had in that time? 6
Degu years:
- diego 2 years (passed)
- loki 4 years (passed)
- bartlebee (18 month) passed
- triplets (3 years) now 7 years old
Have you ever been bitten by one of your degus?
Yes
Do you know the history of that degu with other humans or degus? (any history of abuse or neglect, was it a lone degu from an early age and so did not learn degu social cues?)
No
Have you ever had a serious bite from your degus?
Yes
If yes, can you recall how many? 1 during a FBOD
In the last 12 months only:
How many times have you been bitten by a degu? nipped 2/3 times over enthusiastic grooming
Approximately how many of those were minor/major/serious?
all minor
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