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Post by junior on Apr 15, 2015 4:40:46 GMT
I have a degu with a very swollen face. I had him to the vet the other day, and they checked the inside of his mouth. His teeth seemed to be okay, but he had a little bump on his gum. A bit of pus came out of it, so I'm hoping that it is a little pocket of infection that an antibiotic can cure, but the doctor also said that it could be a tumor. He had a shot of antibiotic, and now I'm supposed to be giving him oral meds. Does anyone have any suggestions for administering liquid antibiotics to a degu? I tried hollowing out a little section on a nut and filling it in with the AB. I hope it worked - it was hard to tell if he ate the entire thing because he took it off to a dark corner of the cage. Does anyone know of a better way to give a degu meds? Is there any safe food I can put it on that he will eat willingly? Thanks so much for your help!
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Post by titchycatnipsandwich on Apr 15, 2015 6:30:01 GMT
River likes a pinch of oats, or a piece of cracker. Depends on the antibiotic though, he'll take the paediatric banana co-trimoxazole straight from the syringe and try to bite me and it when the syringe is empty... But I have to use oats for enrofloxacin, he doesn't like straight aniseed, and meloxicam can be a bit hit and miss as to whether he'll take it from the syringe or not. Easiest to just drip them onto oats/a piece of cracker and let him have at it. Weirdly enoug, I've been able to use the antibiotics as a post-pus-draining treat, River hasn't quite worked out they're supposed to be good for him
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jos
Warbling Degu
Posts: 33
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Post by jos on Apr 15, 2015 11:45:19 GMT
I also used oats with good success. People often mention shreddies work well, but I couldn't find sugar-free ones so tried shredded wheat which went down well with my other two but the one who needed abs wouldn't touch it. I ended up applying the meds to oats and flaked peas and these were generally accepted.
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Post by Kins on Apr 15, 2015 11:56:55 GMT
I had to do it the hard way as I needed to make sure Nige was definitely getting all of the ABs. I had to hold him using my 1st and 2nd finger either side of his neck (with my hand around his back) and then the other hand to hold/support his back legs. It is not easy and you have to be fairly confident and just do it. My husband had to actually administer the medication by squirting it directly into Nige's mouth so, for me, this method requires 2 people. It' hard to describe, the attached website shows the 'hold' in picture 5 at the bottom of the page www.vetsonline.com/publications/veterinary-times/archives/n-44-38/guide-to-husbandry-and-common-diseases-in-degus-and-skunks.html
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 15, 2015 15:09:29 GMT
How long is it since you saw the vet? If there is pus coming out, it seems likely the lump is an abscess, so it's really important you get the antibiotics into him, also you would expect to see gradual improvement with the antibiotics, so if its is continuing to get worse phone the vet and you might need to try a different antibiotic. There are lots of different foods you can try putting the medication on, foods that will absorb it work best, but anything can work if they like that food enough. Try things with a strong flavour. If you can get peanut butter with nothing added (just mushed peanuts) then that might work. See nutrition charts for ideas for safe things deguworld.proboards.com/thread/15602/vegetable-seed-nut-nutrition-chartGood info from Kins there if you need feed direct with syringe.
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Post by junior on Apr 15, 2015 15:54:06 GMT
River likes a pinch of oats, or a piece of cracker. Depends on the antibiotic though, he'll take the paediatric banana co-trimoxazole straight from the syringe and try to bite me and it when the syringe is empty... But I have to use oats for enrofloxacin, he doesn't like straight aniseed, and meloxicam can be a bit hit and miss as to whether he'll take it from the syringe or not. Easiest to just drip them onto oats/a piece of cracker and let him have at it. Weirdly enoug, I've been able to use the antibiotics as a post-pus-draining treat, River hasn't quite worked out they're supposed to be good for him Thank you for the advice. Sorry to ask stupid questions, but are you talking about whole oats in the husk or an oatmeal type of oats? He eats oats in the shell, but I've never tried giving him the oatmeal type. If it's okay to give them that, I could definitely try it. It seems like it would soak up the meds pretty well.
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Post by junior on Apr 15, 2015 15:55:03 GMT
I also used oats with good success. People often mention shreddies work well, but I couldn't find sugar-free ones so tried shredded wheat which went down well with my other two but the one who needed abs wouldn't touch it. I ended up applying the meds to oats and flaked peas and these were generally accepted. Another stupid question - what are shreddies?? I keep reading about them in various posts, but I'm not sure what they are. I think I can get shredded wheat without sugar, so that may be another option.
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Post by junior on Apr 15, 2015 15:58:59 GMT
I had to do it the hard way as I needed to make sure Nige was definitely getting all of the ABs. I had to hold him using my 1st and 2nd finger either side of his neck (with my hand around his back) and then the other hand to hold/support his back legs. It is not easy and you have to be fairly confident and just do it. My husband had to actually administer the medication by squirting it directly into Nige's mouth so, for me, this method requires 2 people. It' hard to describe, the attached website shows the 'hold' in picture 5 at the bottom of the page www.vetsonline.com/publications/veterinary-times/archives/n-44-38/guide-to-husbandry-and-common-diseases-in-degus-and-skunks.htmlThanks so much for the advice. The vet actually recommended doing it this way and shooting it right into his cheek to make sure he's getting it all. Unfortunately, my husband couldn't seem to hold onto him well enough for me to shoot it into his mouth, and I worried that we were getting him too stressed out. I know we were certainly getting stressed out!! We eventually gave up. I hollowed out a little hole in an almond, put the meds in the hole, and then sealed it up with the grindings that accumulated after drilling out the hole. He ate it, but I worry that some of it may have been wasted in the crumbs that dropped off while he was eating it.
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 15, 2015 16:00:40 GMT
Are you in USA, or non UK anyway? Shreddies are a packet cereal in UK. Any type of cereal like shredded wheat is fine for medication purposes as long as there is no added sugar and preferably no salt.
And yes, oats generally means oatmeal over here, we also call it porridge oats sometimes, it means the flattened grains of oats anyway.
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Post by junior on Apr 15, 2015 16:07:27 GMT
How long is it since you saw the vet? If there is pus coming out, it seems likely the lump is an abscess, so it's really important you get the antibiotics into him, also you would expect to see gradual improvement with the antibiotics, so if its is continuing to get worse phone the vet and you might need to try a different antibiotic. There are lots of different foods you can try putting the medication on, foods that will absorb it work best, but anything can work if they like that food enough. Try things with a strong flavour. If you can get peanut butter with nothing added (just mushed peanuts) then that might work. See nutrition charts for ideas for safe things deguworld.proboards.com/thread/15602/vegetable-seed-nut-nutrition-chartGood info from Kins there if you need feed direct with syringe. We saw the vet on Monday, and he got his first dose then (by injection). Last night (Tuesday), I gave it to him on an almond, and today I gave it to him on a little peanut treat. Again, though, I worry that some of it may have been lost in crumbs. I don't actually see pus coming out, but when the doctor checked out his mouth, he pulled out a little bit of tooth with a small glob of pus. Last night when I dosed him, he actually looked worse than he had on Monday - his face seemed a little more swollen, and although he ate eagerly, it took him a long time and he seemed to have some trouble with his mouth at times. This morning, however, I think he looks a little bit better. The eye doesn't seem to be as squinty as it was yesterday, and the cheeks look a bit less swollen. I'm hoping that means the ABs have kicked in. I just wish I could find some really absorbent food that wouldn't break down into crumbs as easily. Anyway, I seem to be getting some of it in him at least. Thanks so much for the nutrition chart. I will go through it to see if there is anything that seems to fit the "absorbent-but-not-crumby" description! Thank you all again! I will keep you all posted. Please send good thoughts his way!!
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Post by junior on Apr 15, 2015 16:13:22 GMT
Are you in USA, or non UK anyway? Shreddies are a packet cereal in UK. Any type of cereal like shredded wheat is fine for medication purposes as long as there is no added sugar and preferably no salt. And yes, oats generally means oatmeal over here, we also call it porridge oats sometimes, it means the flattened grains of oats anyway. Thanks so much for the information. Yes, I am in the US. I think I can get shredded wheat without any sugar, and I'm certain that I can get oatmeal. I've never given him any oatmeal; that will be a new treat for him! I've been ordering his food online from a place that sells a degu pellet mixed with oats. Degu food is not available in pet stores in the US, so it is always a problem to get things for him. I was so happy to find this site because degus aren't really kept as pets over here, and it's hard to get any information about them. My degu was the first one the animal hospital had ever seen. What vegetables do your degus usually eat? I'm always worried about giving them ones that are safe for them. They are now about 8 years old.
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 16, 2015 10:02:41 GMT
We have loads of feeding information you can have a look through. If you start with the feeding guide it links you through to other relevant pages deguworld.proboards.com/thread/16425/degu-feeding-guideSee nutrition charts for more info on veg (and important seeds) deguworld.proboards.com/thread/15602/vegetable-seed-nut-nutrition-chartsWe also have an American thread deguworld.proboards.com/thread/16569/links-herb-supplies-american-threadsBasically if you feed plenty of forage then vegetables aren't so important. I feed a few dried veg as treats, peppers, courgette, broccoli etc. Leafy veg like salad leaves, dandelions, carrot tops etc can count towards forage. In normal circumstances we don't normally recommend adding grains like oats to the diet, or commercial foods that are grain based as they get turned to sugars on digestion and also grains are high in phosphorus and low in calcium and we are constantly trying to keep the calcium above the phosphorus, so you may want to check out the figures for your bought food. (more info in diet section, I think there are a couple of US foods in the commercial food chart). Anyway, your degus are doing pretty well at 8 yrs old I hope the oatmeal or shredded wheat helps get the meds in and that today brings a confirmation of improvement.
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jos
Warbling Degu
Posts: 33
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Post by jos on Apr 16, 2015 13:45:08 GMT
Sorry for the late reply, like moletteuk says, shredded wheat and shreddies are cereals in the uk. Their advantage is that goos tend to like them a lot and the liquid meds readily soak into them. In the UK, the only shreddies or non-brand equivalent I could find had 15% sugar so too high to be given regularly but shredded wheat were ok.
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Post by junior on Apr 16, 2015 14:07:11 GMT
Thank you so much for all of the great information. I really appreciate it. I have been feeding them a hay pellet/whole oats mixture with unlimited Timothy hay for the past eight years. I supplement it with dried flowers, occasional nuts and seeds, little bits of veggies, and small bits of raw carrot and sweet potato from time to time. They seemed to do so well for so long, but this problem with his mouth really has me worried. I got the meds in him again today, and his face is definitely not as swollen as it had been. I noticed, though, that he chews very slowly, so something is definitely still bothering him. He's active and eager to eat, but I hope it isn't a tumor. I'm so worried. Please send good thoughts his way...
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Post by deguconvert on Apr 17, 2015 4:40:42 GMT
Definitely will be keeping him in my thoughts. I truly hope he will steadily improve. Do you have any followup appointments set with your vet? Where in the mouth is this abscess . . . back near the molars or up front? I'm just wondering if the tooth itself is abscessed.
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Post by junior on Apr 17, 2015 4:59:06 GMT
Just got home from work about an hour ago and checked in on him. He is very active and his face seems a bit better, but as I said before, he chews slowly and it looks like his mouth bothers him a bit. The bump on his gum is just a bit to the right of the bottom front teeth. No, I don't have any follow-up visits scheduled. He's supposed to have the meds for 10 days, so that's seven more days to go. I guess I'll see how he's doing after that. I can't really look inside his mouth myself, but if his chewing doesn't improve, I'll bring him again.
Thanks so much for the good thoughts and all of the advice. I really appreciate it.
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Post by junior on Apr 17, 2015 5:04:27 GMT
Sorry for the late reply, like moletteuk says, shredded wheat and shreddies are cereals in the uk. Their advantage is that goos tend to like them a lot and the liquid meds readily soak into them. In the UK, the only shreddies or non-brand equivalent I could find had 15% sugar so too high to be given regularly but shredded wheat were ok. Thanks so much for the help. I really appreciate it!! With other animals it's easy enough to find something to put meds on, but with all of the dietary restrictions degus have, it's a bit more challenging, isn't it?
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 17, 2015 12:27:23 GMT
It's much more likely to be an abscess than a tumour, dental issues are very common in degus.
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Post by junior on Apr 17, 2015 13:17:02 GMT
I was hoping, actually, that it was an abscess rather than a tumor since I thought that would be the easier one to cure. The vet told me that if it's a tumor, there really isn't anything he can do for him, especially since he's already 8 years old. I just went out to give him his meds, and I must say, he doesn't look any better to me. I thought maybe the swelling was going down a bit yesterday, but today he looks just as swollen as ever, and it's taking him a long time to chew the food with the meds on it. Today I put it on half a hollowed-out almond with almond shavings stuffed in the hole with the meds, and he ate the whole thing and licked up all the crumbs. I gave his brother about the same amount so that they wouldn't fight over it, and his brother was finished with his portion in no time flat, but the other guy took a long time to chew it up. I'm so worried about him... Any other suggestions for a mouth abscess??
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 19, 2015 9:42:30 GMT
How is he doing now?
Well the trouble with mouth abscesses is that they often occur at the site of a dental issue, so this might need further investigation to solve the problem. It's a bit more unusual to have the issue next to the incisors though, with it being at the front, at least it should be possible to restrain the degu without sedation to get a good look. It might be worth trying to get xrays. Let's see how he responds he responds to the ABs.
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