Yet another Vet visit tomorrow!

[luna1]

As some of you will know, I seem to have the unhealthiest Degu clan in the entire world. If my Vet didn't know better, I swear he would think that I had some kind of mental disorder whereby I imagined health problems where none existed

Luna: as usual, the little madam ( currently down to 189 grams in 10 days) is now refusing all food and even storing homemade cookies, her teeth haven't been rasped since Feb so we are obviously coming up to that time again. she is currently being force fed critical care through the syringr to try and get some weight on her before the inevitable procedure. Not that it will make any difference to her as all food is 'poisonous' in her book

Munchkin: Her teeth were rasped 10 days ago for the very first time in 2 1/2 yrs but despite this, she is still very depressed and has lost 19 grams in 10 days. Goodness knows what her problem is but she is loving the heat pad right now, it's her new best friend!

Bo: he had his lower molar roots done a month ago and not only is he not eating, he has dropped to 180 grams in 10 days but is still very lively and normal - not the word that anyone could use to describe Bo really ;D-

Reza rizzles : He had a gum abscess and needs regular dental rasping done but he is very depressed and very low in weight, too low considering what a big boy he normally is.

Madam Tia: she has had 2 surgical procedures for lower molar roots and normally needs rasping every 3 weeks. She was showing signs of either a sinus or upper resp infection at the end of last week so I have been dosing her on Baytril. Her runny nose has stopped but she is coming up for dental work and another X-Ray as I am terrified that her upper roots may start to cause a problem. Ironically, she is one of the few who has maintained her weight .

And then there is my ongoing major worry, Nozzle. He is having ok days and bad days. He has put on weight but then that is because I am syringe feeding him critical care 3 times a day. He is eating bits and pieces, including hay in the cage but not enough to sustain him. He seems to need Meloxicam nearly every day and this morning, the eye on his paralysed side is completely shut and crusty so I have been dealing with that. It has been an ongoing problem because he can barely blink on that side. The only good thing recently is that his head tilt has vastly improved. He is not too good today and sleeping a lot as he is prone to doing when he feels not so good. Days like today with him frighten me as I know that the inevitable is getting nearer and whenever I consider doing the kindest thing for him, he then turns it around and does something that is more like his old self, he is literally fighting for his life trying to contend with his breathing difficulties on one side but it is so very, very hard for him.....and me he is breaking my heart....

So that is where I am amt right now and although I am not posting this for any particular reason, I suppose it helps to vent my anger at the unfairness of it all. And just to add to my woes, the eating issues are still ongoing and I could quite happily emigrate right now

[blossombrooks]

Oh that all sounds terrible :-( you must be going through hell with all that happening. So are they all off to the vets tomorrow? I really hope they decide to eat properly soon and poor little nozzle has a better day ahead of him. He's such a fighter. I'm sure you've tried this but would a bit of walnut go down any better? I know it's terribly fattening but I had an issue with Pep refusing food every so often and I found she actually got excited about eating it. I think it has a stronger aroma than other nuts. Keep your chin up, theyre lucky to have such a caring owner. :-)

[deguconvert]

I agree, they are blessed to have such a caring owner!! I wish I could think of something that would totally energize their appetites . . . I just don't know what it could be. I have been looking/thinking of appetite tonics for my son . . . maybe some of the tonics that are herbs and vitamins would be of help to degus as well? Given in tiny, tiny dosages of course, but perhaps they would help?

[moletteuk]

Hugs to you Luna, I can't think of anything more constructive. You must feel like hosing them down with a high power spray of porridge sometimes!

Have you seen Davx mention that horsetail and high silica grasses are best for molar wear? It's only really been mentioned in passing, do I don't know if there are any specific grasses, and don't know whether fresh, dried or hay is best, also the horsetail is a bit scary sounding because I gather it's dangerous for cows & horses. Maybe you could try asking him more about it?

[blossombrooks]

How did you get on at the vets luna? Hope everyone is showing some improvement!

[moletteuk]

Hope everythings OK, Luna.

[luna1]

Thank you all for letting me vent ;D

I have heard about silica wearing teeth, I normally feed readigrass a couple of times per week but of course, they won't touch it now! I have a theory that because none of them are eating properly and haven't been for a while, their teeth are suffering as a result. Not just because they aren't wearing them down through chewing but because their Cal/Phos ratio is probably off the wall in terms of balance. I have made a decision now that they are all going to get pellets and hay and nothing more. I seem to remember reading somewhere that a Degu will never starve itself....HUH! they haven't met Luna who I am sure has Degu anorexia as for the others, well only time will tell.

I am feeling somewhat lonely today as 9 of my Degus are all at the Vets, 4 for procedures and the others go along to keep them company. I never send a Degu on it's own because of the hassle caused in putting them back together later and having company seems to help them recover quicker after the anaesthetic. So I am left with Nozzle and Boss, who is missing his ladies so much....they live next door, that he is laying around on his snug sulking ;D

Mondays visit highlighted that Luna probably has a spur or 2 in her mouth as when the scope was put in her mouth, before any looking was done, there was blood and saliva, a sure sign of something amiss.

Munchkin got a clean bill of health so we have decided that she is probably depressed as a result of her procedure the week before. She is very sensitive and has recently not been very happy as we revamped the girls cage and put the hammock in a different place, would you believe that she is still sleeping on her tube at night while the other 2 sleep in the hammock??

I didn't take Tia as my Vet and I decided a long time ago that putting her through a general mouth inspection is too risky. She gets so stressed that she holds her breath until her gums turn blue so has to be revived with pure Oxygen. He trusts me to know when something is wrong so I booked her in for an X-Ray for upper molars and while she is out, dental rasping as there is bound to be something there. Although I am quite pleased with her at the moment, she has gone up to 275 grams, she is a very large girl though and also likes to eat Harry's food as well as her own, he's terrified of her as she is a grumpy girl so he has to be fed separately when the monster is sleeping ;D

Reza has spurs as expected.

Diezel started fussing around his penis again and made it bleed. He has had 4 procedures done on it since October last year because he is rather...um...well endowed and it kept getting stuck out. His sheath was made bigger and then smaller and then bigger. My Vet was away at a conference last week and he has heard of a new procedure that was pioneered in the USA for this type of problem so he will applying his new found knowledge (hopefully) today on my boy.

Nothing wrong with Bo apart from 'Luna syndrome'

Nozzle has really picked up and the strangest thing has happened. Monday morning there was gunge stuck to his tatty ear and when I bathed it a lot of pus came out. I took him along to get checked that evening and we are all in agreement that this may have been what has been causing his general lethargy and depression. He brightened up no end and, touch lots of wood, has continued to stay bright up til now. He is on high dose Marbocyl (Antibiotic, it deals better with severe or deep infection but is very unpleasant) and I have to rub his ear a couple of times a day to encourage the ear to empty. Since his op back in Feb we have never found any pus, despite suspecting that it was there but very deep inside. The second ear procedure was done for this reason, hoping to find something in there but it was clear at the time. We think that it has taken all of this time to come out. He finally had his stitches removed 2 weeks ago when he was in having his teeth done and I think that this has been what has finally allowed the pus to blow it's way out. So for the moment, I feel a bit more optimistic. He managed to clear 15 ml of critical care yesterday, 1 bowl of food, lots of hay and 3 homemade peanut cookies ;D this is more like the old Noz......god I love him

moletteuk, LOL, at hosing them down with a high pressure spray of porrige, oh I wish......

So I am picking them all up this afternoon and am dreading Luna as she always comes out with a swollen mouth and drooling, because she is so small her mouth is very difficult to get into without causing some discomfort. Oh fun oh joy syringing food into her tonight, poor little thing.

Sorry for that long, long post....whenever I update on any of my lot it always turns into a Biography

[coronasol]

Oh wow, what a stressful time it must be I hope they all come back ok and thankful for all you do for them. They really are so fortunate to have such a caring 'Mum' And that's great you send them all together for company too. Keep us posted, and if it helps you feel better, keep writing the long posts! We're all here to offer words of support and advice where we can! (although being a newbie I'm not much help!!)

[yasmin]

Sounds like issues are being resolved – that's a good thing. I am learning alot reading about your goos, Luna1. Your posts are nicely organized so they're easy to read and very informative.

It seems that close observation and vet visits are part of degu ownership as is dealing with/getting to know each degu's unique personality. All food for thought and helpful prep for me and my hoard that is having issues of its own. Looking forward to reading more on your degus' progress.

[listracian]

Have you tried feeding ultragrass? All the goos, chillas, piggies, wallabies and rabbits eat it at uni and its suppose to be full of nutrients and they don't have to eat a lot to get it all in. They feed it a lot to the pregnant and ill ones as well as its suppose to help them. I don't know whether its worth looking into? Its nice and green and smells really fresh, the lot at uni go crazy for it!

[luna1]

Thank you for the suggestion listracian I will definitely look into ultragrass and give it a try.

coronasol, I am sure that you have lots to contribute, being a newbie doesn't mean that you know nothing, there are lots of people on here and other forums that have owned Degus for years and have been lucky enough to have never suffered with health problems so they are not au fait with the various problems, me....it was a baptism of fire, I owned my first lot for a week, 5 yrs ago, before we were rushing to a Vet and it doesn't seemed to have stopped since LOL.

yasmin, I am so pleased that you find my rambling posts useful ;D no, seriously, it is brilliant if you can get some value out of my experiences, this is mainly why I post. I don't think that everyone realises what hard work they can be. I do hope that the problems that you are experiencing with your Degus are not overly serious, what is wrong?

Update on last nights collection.

Luna: as expected had a small spur that was cutting into her cheek so that was rasped down. But it certainly wasn't bad enough to have stopped her eating. Albeit, she hasn't really been eating properly since last Dec when we had all the gut problems, that actually turned out to be constipation. But at that time we all thought that she had an intestinal tumour as a mass showed up on X-Ray. She has given me more scares than I could ever list down here and she is only 2 1/2!!!

Tia: she had to have yet another bottom molar removed as it was fractured. The reason for this is that it now appears that her bottom molars are growing forward and damaging the neighbouring teeth we know that she has confirmed Malocclusion and she has already had 2 bottom molar root procedures. The X-Ray also showed that one of her upper roots is starting to grow into her nasal cavity but at this point in time it is very slight. I am still devastated though as this was one of my worst fears for her She also had some spurs rasped, as she seems to need this doing every 3 weeks. All of this sounds very cruel but I am adamant that she is happy, adored and really enjoys her life. As she is seen so regularly it will be managed to her best advantage. Her greatest pleasure in life is chasing Harry, moaning at Harry, stealing from Harry, biting Harry, eating and having a crafty cuddle with me when she thinks no one is watching she has a reputation to uphold and noone must know, except me of course, what an absolute sweetheart she can be ;D

I have quite a nice collection of Degu teeth now but don't want to add to it again!

Diezel: looking very sorry for himself and is on high dose Metacam. BUT, he still won't leave his area alone so it looks like he will, again, undo all of the good that we have done. Unfortunately, if it doesn't work this time and his problem inevitably starts again, then he may be looking at having his area replumbed and losing his penis, OUCH!!

Reza: nasty spurs again and a gum infection.

I dream of the day when responsible breeding is in place and we can eradicate a lot of these problems. I am in no doubt that my lot are suffering as a result of their heritage, most of which, but not all, I am unaware because they are rescues. It makes me so angry when I hear of the ignorance that surrounds Degus in general, especially close relation breeding and 'back breeding' it could all so easily be avoided if it weren't for ignorance or, in some cases, blatant neglect in an ideal world, pet shops would not be able to sell any animals, of course, including Degus. This is where it all starts, mis sexing, pregnant before they leave the shop and then people indiscriminantly breeding them as they think that they can make some money. There is still this misconception out there that they are only rodents so therefore, inbreeding is acceptable when it couldn't be any further from the truth. I also cannot wait for them to be reclassified to Octodon/Caviomorph, then it might make some people question more what they are taking on instead of lumping them in the 'rodent category' - or is this just utopia?....... Probably.

RANT OVER ;D

[moletteuk]

Your long posts are interesting and invaluable in so many ways, I'm grateful and happy that you take the time to share with us

Very worrying longer term for Tia and short term for Diezel. Hopefully things are looking up for Nozzle and Luna. Fingers tightly crossed for all of them, as ever.

[yasmin]

Right on, luna1! I second your rant. The issues with my goos is also probably the result of inbreeding. And, yup, I adopted four girls from the local animal shelter only to realize, after Azure had a miscarriage (stupid me), that I had three girls and a boy. Lilac and Peridot subsequently had litters and it's probably inbreeding that's causing a likely autoimmune disorder with vasculitis-type symptoms in some of Peridot's babies (they're now 6 months old). I believe Sean (aka Sienna) is Peridot's litter-mate brother. I also am dealing with Azure's lingual malocclusion.

I share your dream.

That said, I hope for the best for Tia – I hope either a miracle happens and those upper roots stop growing into her nasal cavity or that, at least, they grow slowly. Can they extract those teeth as well? And poor Diezel – ouch!!

[luna1]

Oh yikes Yamin, you sound like you really have a lot to deal with

I must say that I have never come across vasculitis.....YET! Malocclusion is never nice and unfortunately, as you and I both know, it is not a problem that will ever go away.

Elodontoma (root elongation) often goes, but not always, hand in hand with malocclusion and in Tia's case we can only keep the spurs and overgrowth in her actual mouth in check so that it discourages the roots from growing upwards. There will inevitably come a time when the roots grow upwards and yes, the teeth can be removed but the roots are not so very easy. Sometimes they are not that deep rooted so come out very easily or other times, they are so firmly embedded that they either break when being removed or there is a bit left in there that is invisible to the eye and the whole problem starts all over again.

There is also the problem of knowing where to 'go in' IE, incision area, if the roots are quite far up then you risk causing damage to the ear, eye, facial nerves, possibly causing facial paralysis or in the worst case, brain damage. The problem with Degu's is that they are just too small for such delicate procedures and although it can be done, there is very rarely, a positive outcome.

I will definitely do some research on auto immune vasculitis conditions and if anything comes to light that may be useful to you then I will gladly pass it on