Sick Degu

[swampkandy]

Hello,

One of our girls has been unwell for the last month or so - it started as a sneeze which we thought was due to dust so we switched to a dust free bedding of Finicard and dust extracted hay but it continued.

There was no discharge to be seen and none of the others displayed any symptoms.

She then developed a sort of audible internal hiccup/coughing sensation which as not stopped for over 3 weeks now, she is at it constantly.

I took her to the vet and was given some Baytril for a week (2 x a day) which, although tough to administer, seemed to be having a positive effect. On our follow up, we were given a further few days antibiotic.

However, the hiccup/cough remains, she seems fairy stiff/robotic in movement and looks worn out with her eyes half shut when in her nest. When shes up and about or being held, she seems herself - she has always been the sleepy one of the bunch.

Every few days she has some frothy discharge in her eye which she cleans off herself.

The past few days since the Baytril she has had the runs - hopefully this is just a side effect of coming off it though.

She is still eating/drinking and grouping with her sisters.

Am at a loss as to what to do next - I don't want to keep filling her with antibiotics as that would surely kill her and I had my doubts if the vet we saw even knew what a Degu was so do not feel very optimistic to return for more help.

I have uploaded a video of what she is like - she does this 24/7. 



Any advice on what it could be / what to do next?

Natasha

[deguconvert]

She is really laboring to breathe, the poor little love. Degus do not breathe through their mouths at all, and when they do out of desperation, they actually suck air into their stomachs and end of with bloat, which is dangerous. Somehow her nostrils or airway must be blocked to a degree, or swollen. I think your vet needs to find out what is happening in the nasal cavity, and that probably has to be done with an X-Ray. And by the looks of her, ASAP! She may need to be very lightly sedated to help with the X-Ray, if she is well enough to tolerate the sedation. A whiff of gas may be easier on her than to use the injected anesthesia. I think she needs to be seen again urgently. Many vets to not charge an examination fee for looking into an issue they have been treated for already.

[yasmin]

Your poor degu...her robotic movements and half shut eyes indicate that she is feeling miserable.

Her breathing reminds me of that of my degu Lilac who had molar roots growing into her nasal cavity. In the later stages, one of her eyes also had a discharge coming from it on and off.
My Lilac was on and off off Baytril (2 weeks on, a week off generally) for more than year to treat recurrent infections caused by the roots penetrating more tissue (the discharge was one sign that an infection had flared up) and she also got Metacam (painkiller and anti-inflammatory) every two days for a year and a half. She did quite well despite being medicated for a long time. However, she was very easy to medicate so she did not suffer the stress that usually goes with force feeding it. (She drank the Ribena-flavored Baytril right from the syringe, and she happily ate peas with a drop of Metacam on them.)

Lilac ate only selectively (only bits that were flat and thin) and never had diarrhea, so it may be something else that your degu is ailing from.

• If the antibiotics are working then maybe another week or round of them will help; though the diarrhea is concerning (may or may not be due to the Baytril).

• An x-ray would show if it is a molar roots issue and possibly would show if there is gas accumulating in her stomach/intestines. However. the vet may not want to do an x-ray because, with her breathing issues, it can be extra risky to sedate her even lightly. (I took that risk with Lilac because I needed to know what the issue was. Her breathing looked so awful I thought that she was going to die anyway.)

How old is she?
Is she losing weight?

[moletteuk]

She looks really poorly, she's working hard just to take air in.

It looks like she probably has a sinus infection. The question is whether it is secondary to a dental issue.

Has she lost any weight? Have her eating habits changed at all?

You could try a different antibiotic, respiratory infections can be quite hard to pin down, marbocyl or septrin could be worth a try. You could give her Critical Care or another recovery food at a different time of day to the antibiotic to try to tackle the diarrhoea.

If she doesn't respond to the second antibiotic after a few days, then she needs xrays to check the dental situation and the vet could do a nasal rinse to get a sample of whatever infection is in her sinuses so you can give the correct antibiotic.

You may need to ring round your local vets to find an experienced one to do the xray and nasal rinse.

[animalmadchloe]

As above I'd go straight back to your vets asap! She really looks as though she's struggling to take in breaths. Poor girl she must me miserable.

[swampkandy]

Thank you all for your replies.

Her appetite seems selective, grazing on oats/millet to keep her energy up which we normally just give for treats, she also seemed appreciative that we crushed her kibble up (Selective brand) so perhaps might hint at a dental issue?
Age unfortunately is unknown, we adopted them together from P@H who didnt have a date either.All we know is that one of the 3 was introduced to the sisters, so perhaps she is older. We have had her for 2 years now and looking back to photos, have definitely grown a great deal.
Weight is difficult to judge but she had lost a few grams between vet visits, she was 220g and just under 200 a week later but the vet himself said he thought the scales were acting up.

Will get her booked in tomorrow asap.

Will keep you posted, thanks again

[deguconvert]

Glad you are booked in. Will be looking forward to what is learned.

[swampkandy]

Just back from the vet and their most knowledgeable rodent expert who listened to her and felt she was having more difficulty exhaling, than taking air in. She likened it to a human having asthma, potentially lung disease.

The vet weighed up the options - try an xray but warned she didn't feel very optimistic in sedating her due to her breathing. The other was trying further antibiotics and an anti inflammatory which I am to give her over the next few days and monitor her condition.

We were quite shocked to see how much weight she has lost , from 220g on 9th Nov, to 168g today.

The medication is :

Baytril (same as before)
Loxicom (anti inflammatory)
Bisolvon (muscus powder)
Recovery plus mixture to try and put on some weight

I couldn't believe there was so few "licensed" drugs available for Degus's, considering their introduction as pets came from meticulous laboratory testing for humans, yet so few available for them, seems so unfair.

So I will be nursing her closely over the next few days and just see what happens, I really hate filling her with drugs but am willing to try it before the ultimate risk of sedating her.

Her condition today remains the same, perky and alert when out of the nest, but seems in discomfort when resting. She seems happy to be alive and enjoys her sisters company who I sense recognise her weakness as they always protect her from me.

Fingers crossed.

Thanks again for all your support, its very comforting having such a community to hand.

Update : she loves peanut butter, anything to try and stop there weight loss .

[moletteuk]

With her having lost so much weight I think you need to see some improvement quite quickly, so do get back in touch with the vet ASAP if you have any concerns. Try to tempt her with all kinds of high calorie foods, preferably in quite small pieces or even mashed or made into a slurry or paste, whatever she shows any interest in, nuts and oats are a good place to start.

Since she is worse in the nest and the vet mentioned asthma, I would try eliminating all sources of dust from her surroundings. You might even want to consider removing all substrate for a few days, swapping bedding for a little kitchen roll, put the hay in a location as far from the nest as possible or even try hay cakes. You can also think about any possible allergens or irritations like air freshener, cleaning sprays and products, washing powder etc.

You could consider trying a steam inhalation, this is quite difficult to rig up something safe so you can also do it by putting her in a steamy bathroom for a little while if this is a safer option.

If she has mucus coming out of her nose, did the vet consider sending a sample for identification?


There is a little drug information on degutopia www.degutopia.co.uk/deguvetlist.htm I think it's fairly normal to prescribe unlicensed things for small furry animals, I think there is a reasonable network of informal information out there, I know my vet gets on the internet if necessary. If there is no dosing info for degus then chinchillas are usually the next best thing, but there is usually more info on rats, although degus often need lower doses per kg than rats.

[deguconvert]

I am glad to read your report, and truly hope that with all that the vet has given you, you will see a turn for the better soon. You definitely need to try and get some weight on to her, and I heartily second what Moletteuk recommends.

Please let us know how things go for you and your degu!

[swampkandy]

Hello all,

Tonight may well be her last night with us.
Her condition has rapidly declined at some point today as her responses have nearly all gone, her teeth white but is still breathing, her eyes remain open watching me type.

She is wrapped up warm in her nest with a heatsock, her sisters and some classical music playing which they all seem to enjoy.

The medication seemed to be helping as she was looking stronger the past few days so today was quite a shock to see her in this condition, we even got her to put on some weight with nut butters and oats.
She certainly feasted like a queen over the past week! She loved it, was the first to welcome me every time I entered the room hoping for more.

Thank you all for your brilliant support.
Will update you on her tomorrow.

Natasha x

[swampkandy]

Update

Nibbles passed away at 19:30 tonight, warm in her nest with her sisters watching over her. They even gathered hay and placed it on top of her, was very sweet to see.

May her spirit live on x

[Bexi87]

I'm so sorry for your loss

[newtothis]

oh no, that's awful, so sorry for your loss - RIP Nibbles. They really pull on our heart strings those little furries xx

[deguconvert]

Oh no! I am so sorry, Swampkandy! I am so very sorry for your loss. I love what you said in your post before . . . that she felt like a Queen all this past week. I guess you said she "feasted like a queen" but I think she felt like a queen as well, and was letting you know it. So glad her last week was so beautiful. You did great!

[bouncy]

Oh I'm sorry. Her sisters' behaviour is so sweet, too

[moletteuk]

I'm very sorry for your loss. RIP Nibbles.

[yasmin]

So sad to read this. Had hoped that Nibbles would pull through.
My heart goes out to you.

[animalmadchloe]

Sorry for your loss xx