Lonely timid chin

[fliddie]

Hi all

I have adopted a beautiful chin. He is not a huge fan of my attention, he doesnt seem to have been given much attention by his previous owner and was an ex-show chin before that.

He will sometimes come to me and eat from my hand but this is inconsistent. I initially did get him confident enough to jump out of his cage onto my hands (within a week of adopting him) but he doesnt like being picked up and this poses a problem as I have to chase him round the cage to get hold of him to let him out for exercising daily which undoes any handling trust progress we make. Having said that, he doesnt bark or bite when handled or pursued around the bathroom, he is just very reluctant to be caught and is wriggly!!

Any advice would be much appreciated to whether it would be more beneficial to grow the trusting bond and attempt to get him used to being handled, or letting him out daily for exercise and handling him against his will? Unfortunately I am not able to just open his cage and let him make his own way out due to having to use the bathroom for exercising.

From what I have been told, his previous owners dont seem to have let him out much at all and they dont seem to have handled him much. They said he was roughly handled before this by the show-er and as he is 4 years old I think it will take a long time to break down his association of handling with discomfort.

I did wonder about attempting to introduce him to another chin, I have never tried this before, all my previous chins were either already paired or lived alone. He is not neutered yet (but I would do this if introducing) and is apparently highly aggressive towards cats in particular. He was bought by the previous owners as an introduction to another of their chins but this wasnt successful, they didnt say that he was particularly aggressive towards the other chin though. However I dont know how long they attempted this introduction over. I hate to see him alone, would another chin (if successful) reduce his stress levels?


Sorry for the essay!! Basically 2 questions:

Develop a trusting bond with him first or handle him to get him to the exercise room?

Would thinking about a companion improve his sociablilty and happiness?

[buzz]

Can't say I've had chins but I have read a bit... any excuse not to revise

I'd have thought he'd need neutering like you said... I'd doubt that he'd accept a male.
Its difficult to tell if companionship will improve his sociability with you since he won't need you for that but it has a good chance of improving happiness. Perhaps being in the company of a well socialised female will show him the way... If you can afford two seperate cages if it all goes wrong then I'd go for it. You'll never know with these types of situations untill you try.

By the sounds of it he is not motivated by food which makes it more difficult for you because you can't bribe him. But definately first option is the more important one... you always need trust.

[jackdaniels]

I would personally try both of them methods and see which works best for you.

Ok, only concern would be to get a female preferable a young kit (12 weeks old). Otherwise you may have problems introducing a older chins to him. I have researched about introducing older chinchillas and have tried this myself and the only way I think this would work is doing the breeding technique which i am against. So thats why i would suggest kits.

A part from that I would leave you chinchilla for a few days even weeks to settle down and get use to his new surroundings

[fliddie]

Hiya!

Thank you for your ideas.

He is being quite nice to me today, I have had him now for about 6 weeks. I think I might keep up with the trust building and have come up with the idea of trying to make a little run between his cage in the bedroom and the bathroom so he can come out and run between them of his own accord and not have to be handled which undoes any progress made, hopefully he will then only come to me when (and if!) he wants to, not because he has to be caught to enjoy a run around. All my others just had their cage doors opened and they ran around as they wished to, its just a shame I cant do it with him in my new house.

I might think about getting him a little kit as a companion in a few months time. Am creating a pet room which currently needs complete renovation, and have got him a massive cage thats 5'6" tall and 3' by 3'. I will then have his current cage as a spare for the other one whilst having a go at introductions.

[buzz]

lucky chin

Fingers crossed it all works out for you.

Out of curiosity... what jirds have you got?

[fliddie]

Had a lovely breakthrough tonight, am now convinced I dont have a devil chin!! Gave him lots of new toys today and he went all hyper and I just sat next to his cage with the door open and chatted to him whilst he zoomed around super excited, then he jumped out onto my lap and chewed my jeans! Maybe he doesnt hate me after all, he just wants to do his own thing!

I have got 2 Shaws Jirds, they are lovely little things. They are quite nervous, I think they havent been handled much, one is great once you pick him up he wont go back in his home, he turns round and runs straight back out and up my arm and sits on my shoulder, his brother isnt as confident and doesnt seem to really know how to run through hands. I got them from the pet shop as I felt really sorry for them, they were in a tiny glass cage with nothing to do, thankfully they havent replaced them with any more. Their brothers are still there, nobody wants them, it breaks my heart, if I could reintegrate them back together I would bring them all home but they wouldnt accept each other now. I dont think that they were handled in the pet shop but they are coming round to me, they have a fab 3' long double vivarium the bottom is full of stuff to dig and tunnel in and they have a sand bath, log tunnel and silent spinner wheel in the top that they go in ALL night, grrr! Am going to try and get them a 6' vivarium when they move into my pet room :-)

[buzz]

Aw I love shaw's jirds... I've my eye open for bushy tailed jirds... not that I think I actually should get any.

Perhaps your chin is motivated by new activities then. Does he use a wheel at all?

[fliddie]

Havent seen any bushy tailed jirds, in all honesty, these are the only jirds I have ever seen in real life!!! They are lovely little pets though, if you get tame ones then they are very inquisitive and easy to look after, only problem being that mine are nocturnal so I dont see them too often! Unlike the gerbils who are out and about all the time.

Spyro (chin) has a silent spinner but he doesnt use it, other than to sit in it but either hasnt figured out that it goes around or he isnt interested. When he is put into his huge new cage I am going to give the wheel to the jirds as a second one (as they constantly try and go in theirs together) and will get Spyro a flying saucer one. If he doesnt use it then at least I tried and it can stay in there. There just isnt room in his normal sized cage for one at the moment.

I found out last night that he gets immensely excited about chew toys that he can pick up and run off with so am gonna go onto chinchillas2home and get him some of their small toys.

Am getting new carpets laid in my house next week, am thinking that I might get his new cage put together (its a massive metal monster) then. Cant wait until the room downstairs is ready in a few months time. I get as excited as the creatures do about creating new homes for them!!!

[jackdaniels]

A chinchilla should never use a wheel especially a 12" one they are just way to small and put a lot of strain on there backs. If any i would use either the 16" or the flting saucer wheel.

All just was about to sent it when I see you are thinking about a getting a flying saucer.

Did you know that chinchillas can fall and hurt themselves real bad anything above 3 foot in height. So if you can try and make your 5"6 cage into 2 levels. When I take some pics of my cage I will show you what I mean.

With handling:::most of my chinchillas do not like to handled and put up a bit of a fuss when I pick him he shakes until he knows I have him supported ;D. But as soon as something scares him he is the first one to run to my arms lol.

[fliddie]

I gathered that he may be a bit big for the spinner after watching him sit in it, at the moment he is happy to just sit in there. I have got a load of platforms to put in the tall cage when it is put together, I am going to put them in at about 18" apart so that he cant fall any further than that and will stick a flying saucer in for him on one of the levels.

I have never had any chin before who likes being picked up, even my first one who loved to sleep on me of his own accord (he would stretch out along my back if I laid on my front and would just sleep for ages) liked me but didnt like being picked up. The only reason I am stressing about Spyro is that I need to get him to the bathroom for his run around and I dont want to stress him out by chasing him around when all my others just had their cages opened and got in and out themselves as they chose which I cant do in this house. Although once I do have hold of him he wriggles for maybe 4 or 5 seconds then sits still so he isnt the worst either!

[fliddie]

Well an update for you, kind of happy and kind of sad.

The happy part: I spent a lot of time sitting with Spyro and winnign him over and I constructed his massive new cage which he moved into 2 weeks ago. His personality has transformed with the huge new house he is in. He now bounds up to see me at the bars, he sits chattering away softly to himself and he is much more relaxed when I pick him up - he isnt a fan of being caught but I think that is probably just chins in general. He comes out every night for a run around and seems so much happier. There has been no more barking or shouting and just quiet soft chattery noises.

Now for the sad part. I have noticed over the past few days that he is pawing at his mouth a lot and is seeming to have problems with eating - he manages to eat and still eats a lot but it is looks like it is difficult for him. I am taking him to the vet on friday but I am almost certain they will tell me its malocclusion so my beautiful, transformed little man may be on his way to the bridge. If they confirm malocclusion in the roots then I think I will have to take the heartbreaking decision to let him fall asleep. I could not bear to think of him suffering just because I dont want to lose him. If it is not going to get any better or be manageable for him in any way then I have no choice but to put him to rest before he starts to suffer and have the knowledge that in the last few weeks of his 4 years he was the happiest he has probably ever been. Its going to be a hoodie and super waterproof mascara vet visit for me for sure.

[deguconvert]

I really, really hope that Sypro will be OK, not malocclusions. At the very least, something that can be well and easily treated. He has come so far is such a short time, and you have done such great things for and with him. I hope along with you that he has many years of great happiness yet ahead of him, loved by you.

Would you please say hello to Kimmberley from Deguconvert? I've been missing her! Thanks.

[kimberley]

How odd that ive just read this post today! I havent been on in ages. Last night I visited fliddie n her brood. We had a wee look in spyros mouth n it seemed that he had no front upper teeth n a wee cut on his gum. Fliddie's been to the vet with him this morning so im sure she'll come and update you later on but the gist I got was that he should be fine! I also had a lovely little cuddle with him last night and Fliddie's new chin edition (which im sure she'll also tell you about).

[fliddie]

Yep Spyro was hauled to the vet where he made his feelings very clear, very loudly!

He is weighing about 600g which is ok, the vet said his back teeth look fine and it would seem he has somehow bashed in his front teeth so they have broken off. If he hasnt damaged the roots they will hopefully grow back ok, just have to keep an eye on any weight loss and on his lower front teeth in the meantime so they dont overgrow.

He has picked up a bit and is eating lots of hay and still managing his raisin daily and was gnawing on cuttlefish today and pipes in my bathroom so he cant be feeling too out of sorts.

My new chin edition is a little baby 4 month brown velvet who I have called Vespa. I got him from the Pets at Home adoption bit. I couldnt leave him there. He looked awful, his fur was all chewed, pulled out and manky, he had apparently been thrown in with another older chin without any introductions and they were inevitably fighting. Poor Vespa has holes in his ears and was very timid. I couldnt bear the thought of him going to a home where he would be mauled by children. I have had him 2 weeks now, he has been given lots of love and peace to settle in and he is transformed. He is a very cheeky, tame little monster, his fur looks almost perfect now, he is easy to handle and very inquisitive. He is a chewer and is going to be trouble!!!!!!

[deguconvert]

LOL! So glad to hear that Spyro will be all good. That is WONDERFUL news! Vespa . . . lol, he sounds like a character. I think you must be in love!

[jackdaniels]

Feb 7, 2009 20:07:43 GMT fliddie said:

Yep Spyro was hauled to the vet where he made his feelings very clear, very loudly!

He is weighing about 600g which is ok, the vet said his back teeth look fine and it would seem he has somehow bashed in his front teeth so they have broken off. If he hasnt damaged the roots they will hopefully grow back ok, just have to keep an eye on any weight loss and on his lower front teeth in the meantime so they dont overgrow.

He has picked up a bit and is eating lots of hay and still managing his raisin daily and was gnawing on cuttlefish today and pipes in my bathroom so he cant be feeling too out of sorts.

My new chin edition is a little baby 4 month brown velvet who I have called Vespa. I got him from the Pets at Home adoption bit. I couldnt leave him there. He looked awful, his fur was all chewed, pulled out and manky, he had apparently been thrown in with another older chin without any introductions and they were inevitably fighting. Poor Vespa has holes in his ears and was very timid. I couldnt bear the thought of him going to a home where he would be mauled by children. I have had him 2 weeks now, he has been given lots of love and peace to settle in and he is transformed. He is a very cheeky, tame little monster, his fur looks almost perfect now, he is easy to handle and very inquisitive. He is a chewer and is going to be trouble!!!!!!

Are you going to be introducing them? Have you read up about fur biting and being with other chinchillas. I have a chinchilla who is a fur biter but she doesn't do this to anyone else. Also I was always advised NOT to introduce a male to a male. Please let me know how it goes.

[fliddie]

Oh to clarify - he hasnt been fur biting himself, it was ripped and chewed out by the other he was shoved (rather irresponsibly) into a cage with at P@H. They had been separated again by the time I found him before they had killed each other. Poor little thing had holes in his ears and scabby ears from being attacked, apparently he gave as good as he got though.

I was reading up on the internet and it seems lots of people have lots of ideas as to who can be introduced. Kimberley is getting there slowly with introducing her boys. I am going to see if these two can get on, think it will be a long slow road but as I now have two lovely chins in two massive cages, its worth a shot at saving me some floor space!

[susiechinchilla]

I have always found intro's easier by doing the following;

Place the cages side by side . This allows them to get used to each other. Make sure you keep the cages separated by a gap of 1-2 inches so ensure there are no nipped toes or noses.
After a couple of weeks of this your chins are ready to meet! Let them out on a neutral territory for the first meeting. Put a sandbath on the floor and plenty of toys for distraction. They may ignore each other to begin with but eventually they will notice that there is another chinchilla nosing around! Watch them very carefully to ensure they aren’t fighting. You will see some mounting this is perfectly normal as they are working out who will be the dominant chin. Some fur pulling is acceptable but make sure it doesn’t get out of hand! If they start fighting put them back in their cages and try again in a few days. Keep on with this routine until they are grooming and playing with each other.
Once they have become friends (this can take weeks so please don’t assume that after a few days they can be housed together) you can try putting them in a cage together during the day and see how it goes. If they cuddle up and go to sleep this is a very good sign! However please don’t leave them in the cage longer than a couple of hours as you are gradually getting them used to each other. Keep on doing this every day for a week or so and leaving them in for longer periods (but not overnight just yet!) After a few weeks of this (assuming there are no fights) they are ready to try to spend a night together! Make sure that they have plenty of hiding holes to get away from the other chin if they so desire. Hopefully by this point your chins will be friends and can live together!
Introductions can be very frustrating at times, as it can seem like you are making no progress. Some chins just wont pair up and prefer to live on their own! You have to be prepared for this as nothing with chinchillas is guaranteed. You will have to make time for the chins that wont pair up, as they will look to you for entertainment and stimulation.

Hope your boys get on well together

[kimberley]

My 2 boys have been in their cages next to each other for about 6 weeks now. My original one (Mowgli) will still make angry noises at him from time to time. We have been trying to let them out together for around 10 mins every night for the past month. They do a lot of sniffing around each others mouths n Mowgli even groomed Baloos face for a few moments the other night. Mowgli tries his hardest to jump on Baloos back to show his dominance but Baloo will chase him at this point. At least once in the 10 mins outing Mowgli will charge at Baloo in a nasty manner though and the other night he even ended up with a tuft of Baloos fur in his mouth. Its not all one sided though Baloo will do the same thing occasionally. Theres no way they are ready to be introduced in a cage yet. Do u think we will ever get to this stage Susie? (Forgive me Fliddie for sabotaging ur post !!)

[susiechinchilla]

Feb 8, 2009 14:25:44 GMT kimberley said:

My 2 boys have been in their cages next to each other for about 6 weeks now. My original one (Mowgli) will still make angry noises at him from time to time. We have been trying to let them out together for around 10 mins every night for the past month. They do a lot of sniffing around each others mouths n Mowgli even groomed Baloos face for a few moments the other night. Mowgli tries his hardest to jump on Baloos back to show his dominance but Baloo will chase him at this point. At least once in the 10 mins outing Mowgli will charge at Baloo in a nasty manner though and the other night he even ended up with a tuft of Baloos fur in his mouth. Its not all one sided though Baloo will do the same thing occasionally. Theres no way they are ready to be introduced in a cage yet. Do u think we will ever get to this stage Susie? (Forgive me Fliddie for sabotaging ur post !!)

I would keep going honey . I have had chins that have taken anything from 3 weeks to 6 months to introduce .
You could offer them a sand bath when they are out and also trya few toys around the place
Some chins will have a chase and a tug of one anothers fur as long as it does not become aggressive and they are supervised

Good luck , Just when you think it may never work you can guarantee the chins will decide to accept one another .