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Post by teemu on Apr 1, 2021 14:13:54 GMT
(I figured I would update Pulla's situation here instead of posting frequent updates to the original thread, since that can take attention away from more current issues other people are having.)
Pulla was operated two days ago, and a large lump was removed from the upper part of his abdominal cavity. Now he's going to have to put up with a week (or possibly more) of no climbing, no jumping, no strenuous activity of any kind that might cause the stitches in his abdominal wall to come undone and cause herniation. Unfortunately, Pulla is a very active little guy, and his owner is very fussy, so his recovery is somewhat nerve-wracking to witness!
In two days, Pulla has already basically recovered to normal energy and general wellbeing, so it's definitely starting to be a challenge to keep him calm and all that. I've of course removed all things he could even climb on in his cage (and moved him to another cage where the bars make it practically impossible to attempt to climb them), but he's definitely trying his best to come up with other ways to cause abdominal strain. I had first put newspaper on the floor of his cage, since the idea was that there should be no bedding so the wound can stay as clean as possible, but he very quickly realized that it's super fun to tear and pull at the newspaper and strain at it as hard as he possibly can! So I quickly switched out the newspaper and just resigned to putting hay on the floor of his cage (I would just leave it bare and clean it up often, but it's a birdcage with bars on the floor, and I don't want his feet getting stuck between them or anything). For the moment, that seems to have worked and he's quieted down a bit.
I've also decided to add a lot more outside time in our kitchen to Pulla's schedule, essentially hoping it will help him burn some of his extra energy. He can't do much there either, but he can at least run around. Even there though, I'll have to monitor him pretty closely. He wants to climb on me, start taking imaginary dust baths on the floor (probably too strenuous right now with the whole rolling movement), or otherwise doing things he's not supposed to do. But we're managing
As for recovery itself, it's still pretty early, but it's looking pretty good so far. Pulla is very active again (as you can no doubt tell!) and doesn't seem to be in too much pain. He's mostly left his big surgery wound in peace, although he does often try to groom it. I discourage him when I can, but as long as he's not tearing it open, I suppose it's not the worst thing possible. The vet said that the wound should heal shut in two to three days anyway, so I expect one of the reasons he's grooming it is the itching from healing. He's not making any concerted effort to tear at it, which is the main thing. The blunted teeth and the fact they used skin glue instead of stitches on the outside likely helps (although his teeth aren't nearly as blunted as they probably thought!)
As for myself, I'm just hoping things will go well. I get very easily stressed about the wellbeing of my pets and can be really paranoid about these things, but hopefully everything will go well. Luckily it's Easter and I don't have university lectures or anything until friday the 9th, so I can essentially keep watching him at literally every waking moment (with side glances if nothing else). Things will probably get a lot easier after the weekend.
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Post by hpdegus on Apr 1, 2021 17:57:36 GMT
It sounds like he's doing so well! Glad he's back to normal energy levels (even if it is incredibly stressful for you)!
One thing that will get my goos to calm down and just sit in place is if I give them apple wood sticks. Or a really nice forage mixture that they then sort through to find their favorite pieces. Not sure if either of these would be good distractions for Pulla.
Good job!
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Post by teemu on Apr 1, 2021 18:48:21 GMT
Sadly, Pulla gets a lot of apple wood anyway (my mother has a couple of apple trees on her yard so I can freely harvest big bunches of sticks when I go visit her), so he's not very impressed with that. The foraging idea seems pretty good though, and funnily enough my current batch of hay seems to have a lot of dry green leaves of some sort mixed in (it looks like nonpoisonous meadow plants) which he seems to really like, and he's been very intrested in going through his hay pile to find all of that. I've also been a bit more generous with his treats (I usually give very few treats), so that has helped as well.
Still, the biggest things that have helped seem to have been getting rid of the newspaper and letting him go out more. We had two long outing sessions today, and he's very calm right now. Of course, the problem with his outing time is that he desperately wants to climb me like he always does, and was getting really annoyed towards the end of the evening outing since I kept blocking him. I actually had to stand up so he wouldn't hop on my knee and clamber onto my shoulder (I don't dare put him on my shoulder either, since he could fall, and he often jumps down pretty haphazardly). Not sure how I could fix that, especially since I had to keep interfering with whatever silly ideas he had (rolling around on the floor, trying to jump on something, what have you). Standing up seems to be a decent compromise, but I finding him more non-strenuous things to do in the kitchen would be for the best. It's really hard to come up with activities for a degu that don't involve being jumpy or running around or digging. That's what they do after all!
Still, things went well today, and Pulla is noticeably calmer tonight than he was last evening, which is encouraging. The Snugglesafe has been a hit with him, and I'll need to get one myself after I return this one to the vet.
It's also been intresting to notice that the surgery has had a visible effect on Pulla. He moves very differently from before. I know it's partially the surgery, but his gait when he's moving is much closer to Munkki now, whereas before he seemed a lot clumsier and more bowlegged when he moved. He's also lounging down and lying on his side or all laid out, and I don't even know when the last time was when I saw him do that. In short, it looks like cutting out the ball of nastiness that was in him has really made it easier for him. Makes me wonder how long this thing had actually been bothering him...
Tomorrow it'll be one week since Munkki left us, on a sidenote. I'm really glad to see that despite that and Pulla's whole really sudden thing, he is still perky and full of energy. I'm actually surprised. I was sure he'd be totally miserable, but he's a trooper!
And in other exciting news for Pulla, the local pet store gave me a call today and informed me that they'd been able to order new degus from a Swedish breeder. They could not promise with 100% certainty that they'd actually receive them, since it's technically possible that someone else had placed an order with the breeder before, but they were fairly sure that they will be receiving young girls from the breeder. I'll know next thursday for sure, and if all goes well, then I will be receiving them next monday, 12th of April. AND if all goes well for that, then Pulla should also be back to health by that point. Very exciting!
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Post by bouncy on Apr 2, 2021 0:30:08 GMT
It's a good job you're around! Tell him he'll have to wear a cone of shame if he doesn't behave! Is he able to reach his own stitches? I imagine self-grooming could result in lost stitches....
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Post by teemu on Apr 2, 2021 0:49:13 GMT
He's able to reach the wound, but they used glue instead of stitches (due to his earlier bad reaction with the stitches and all that), and he doesn't seem to be intrested in doing any serious tugging on it. He's groomed it a bit, but from what I can see in my inspections, there's no blood or any sign of tearing. He probably doesn't realize what it is, and since there's nothing to specifically latch onto he's not all that intrested. It's hard to say with the wound since it's glued together anyway, but I think it's also healing pretty well. Seems smaller than it was a couple of days ago, and there haven't been any signs of infection or the like. (I actually had the good foresight to trim the nails on his hind legs when he was still recovering from the anesthesia, since he's actually able to scratch his belly with them. That might also have helped a bit with protecting the wounds.) Can you actually put a cone on a degu? They seem way too nimble and small for that
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Post by bouncy on Apr 2, 2021 11:17:34 GMT
Someone on here had a degu who'd been given what I think was a modified bird cone. He did temporarily lose the fur around his neck, tho!
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Post by teemu on Apr 2, 2021 18:16:30 GMT
Another good day for Pulla. He's feeling energetic, has eaten his meds, has been kept from any strenuous activity, and actually seems to be calmer than yesterday. We only had one outing today because he was feeling lazy in the evening and preferred to lounge on his heatpad (I will seriously need to get him one after I return that one to the vet). So not much to add, thing are proceeding nicely and developments are good!
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Post by hpdegus on Apr 2, 2021 19:13:23 GMT
Yay, that's awesome! And days where you don't have much to add can be the best days!
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Post by bouncy on Apr 2, 2021 19:43:55 GMT
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Post by teemu on Apr 3, 2021 14:34:40 GMT
Today, Pulla decided to be as much of an absolute gremlin during outing time as possible! The boring kitchen floor is obviously getting to him, so he proceeded to find as any ways to push himself into small holes, attempt to climb on top of things I did not think were climbable and make trouble with assorted, harmless-seeming things as possible. It's all good in that he's obviously feeling better and all, but also very good at causing me as much stress as possible! He's also become very, very quick about scoping out his cage door when it opens. It's one of those birdcages where the door is pretty high up, so he's always poised to jump up to it when it's being opened. I quickly have to push a hand in front of him to stop it. But he's smart and learning, so I'll have to be really on top of things. I think that the surgery has ironically actually made it harder to keep him reined in. He's started moving a lot more agilely and quickly now that the big cyst was removed from his belly, and he's obviously very excited about this - and very frustrated that he can't actually do it yet! But I've promised him that after this is over, he'll get all the climbing he could ever want But for now, I think it might actually be best to limit his outing time to one time per day, after all. Since it's not very exciting, he starts to become bored and make mischief. One time per day seems to let him work out some of the extra energy has, but more than that and he just starts to become frustrated with the kitchen as well. We also reached the first actual milestone of his recovery today, since today was the first day I didn't give him Metacam. He was on painkillers for three days after the surgery. Today he only got the antibiotics, but he doesn't even seem to notice it. He did make a bit of fuss about his wound today and made some noises while grooming it (I checked to make sure he wasn't tearing it), but other than that he's been totally alright. That's likely a good sign that he's healing well. I've also been able to feel his belly and aside from the wound itself, I can feel no abnormalities or indicators that his stitches would be failing or that any other problems have come up. The wound itself is also obviously healing. There are some small scratches on it from Pulla's grooming, but they are very surface-level and not bloody or inflamed at all. For now, this recovery is going a lot better than the last one.
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Post by deguconvert on Apr 3, 2021 17:10:11 GMT
WOO HOO!! That is worth a CELEBRATION!! I'm so, so thankful for how much better this is going. You're doing so well with him, Teemu!! Well done!
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Post by teemu on Apr 3, 2021 23:11:28 GMT
Thanks, Deguconvert!
A bit concerned since Pulla has cried out a few times over the evening and early night. He lets out some sharp, very loud noises, but when I go to look at him, he's lying down or otherwise looks totally fine and doesn't seem to be having any issues. It might just be that he feels a twinge of pain from lying down in some positions or so on, but it's hard to say. It's not the normal alarm call degus sometimes cry out for seemingly no reason, it's sharper and quite certainly a pain vocalization. But other than that he's moving normally and restful, so I'm not sure if I should be concerned or not. He doesn't even mind me feeling out his belly carefully after he's made those noises, so it can't be constant pain or anything like that...
I'll keep watching him carefully and give him Metacam if it looks like he's having issues after all.
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Post by deguconvert on Apr 4, 2021 5:56:52 GMT
Unless . . . with him feeling better . . . he is wondering where Munkki is and might be calling for him? Or even calling for you?
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Post by teemu on Apr 4, 2021 9:32:02 GMT
Some of those calls have been higher-pitched and louder than any I've heard. It's essentially a very loud scream, and he goes silent and everything's ok again. It's very weird, I have never heard any vocalization quite like that. It's obviously related to the alarm/distress cry, but sounds more urgent. But he doesn't do a lot of that, he just did it once last night, and there were a couple of cries during the evening. Very weird.
He's been totally normal this morning again, although I've noticed that he has been picking at his surgery wound more. There's a bloody mark on it. It's not serious, just a surface scratch and a scab, and there's no danger of it opening up the wound itself. He's essentially just scratching/teething at the raised skin flabs around the area that as glued together. The underlying surgery wound itself should already have mostly healed (the vet said it would take 2-3 days for the skin to hear, and it's been 5 at this point), but it's hard to tell due to the gluing, so it looks weird even now. I'm not overly concerned about the scratches yet, at least if he doesn't suddenly start digging deeper. Will watch carefully.
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Post by bouncy on Apr 4, 2021 11:32:11 GMT
I would put him back on the metacam.
It's not just pain, but irritation. We all know how tempting it is to attack a scab.....
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Post by teemu on Apr 4, 2021 11:55:06 GMT
That's a good point, Bouncy, thanks for that! I hadn't considered that the Metacam might actually help prevent him from picking at the wound. He has done this thing where he inspects it and makes those quick chirps, which I'd hazard is a good indication of distress. I'll put some painkillers in him right away and see if that makes things better.
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 4, 2021 16:06:58 GMT
Good call Bouncy. It's fairly unusual but an isolated squeal can be a sudden pain response.
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Post by teemu on Apr 4, 2021 17:11:13 GMT
Possible disaster. While Pulla was having his outing time, he suddenly jumped on my knee and jumped down before I could do anything. He landed clumsily and let out a shriek and started limping right away and didn't want me to touch him. I managed to get him back to the cage... and now he seems totally normal again and is rummaging around like nothing happened. I'm very afraid that some of his internal sutures might have opened, but at the same time it totally might be nothing at all and he just twisted his ankle a bit as he came down or even just felt some unpleasant tugging on the sutures even if nothing happened...
Very worried right now. He's back in his cage and eating, drinking and running around. No problems with movement, and I can't feel anything abnormal in his belly and he doesn't seem particularly bothered by me feeling it out. And it's been five days already, and they said that I could start allowing him more movement by tomorrow or the day after tomorrow anyway. But at the same time, this was exactly what they warned me about... Impossible to say if something's wrong or not yet. I suppose I can't do anything but keep observing him and see if he starts looking bad...
To make everything worse, it's sunday today and I'm fairly certain the vet won't be open tomorrow due to Easter. I'd like to get Pulla checked up as soon as possible (I was thinking of asking for a checkup anyway next week), but that's likely not going to happen tomorrow. I guess the only silver lining right now is that by my understanding, even if something did happen and there's a possibility of herniation, it likely wouldn't become dangerous in one day. But I will keep carefully watching him to make sure.
Feeling pretty guilty right now. I knew that jumping on me was exactly what he'd want to do, and yet I somehow let him do that anyway. I've been very anxious about exactly this scenario for this whole time...
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Post by bouncy on Apr 4, 2021 18:28:03 GMT
Don't stress! You've checked him out, he's behaving normally. Goos are overconfident in their abilities to jump and climb (numpties), and never learn from their failures.
It sounds as if he just jarred himself. If you note anything else, I would chalk it up to experience.
With lone goos, you sometimes see an overemphasised behaviour. When Snoozy shoves Sausage or Spud off the ramp, they usually jump up, sit quietly somewhere whilst they check themselves over, then carry on. Squidgy lived alone for a year. When he even just stubbed his toe, he would issue a loud squeak and run around on three legs (fourth tucked up under him) and expect a cuddle. He would do this until he'd forgotten or spotted something he wanted, like a treat.
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Post by teemu on Apr 5, 2021 0:16:30 GMT
Thank you, Bouncy, you're probably right. Pulla was totally normal for the rest of the evening and showed no signs of limping, pain or any distress. He's as energetic as ever.
I think the Metacam also helped a lot since I haven't heard any shrieks or cries from the cage today, and he seems to have been a bit less fussy about the wound. He's picked at it a bit, and I noticed a small piece of string poking out of it (a torn stitch likely, but the wound has already closed so that's not such a bad thing at this point), as well as some scabbing and scratches (probably done last night), but all in all I don't think the wound is in any danger of becoming infected or anything like that, and I disinfect it daily.
The recovery this time seems to be a lot better than it was with the neutering, where both of the boys got their wounds infected and tore off most of the stitches due to irritation. If they're actually allergic to the original stitching material that was used, then switching it to another obviously helped here. I initially thought they used just glue for the surface wound, but after I checked Pulla's paper(and saw the piece in his wound) it turns out that they did use string as well, but a different kind.
Anyway, aside from the scare today, Pulla had another good day of recovery and is energetic and healthy. I've been trying to get his weight up a bit since he's actually quite small (he's now up to around 210-215 grams), and he appreciates the Critical Care he gets in addition to his regular food (it's also very good for making him eat his meds).
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