jelena
Newborn Degu
Miranda and Barabra our two cheecky girl goos
Posts: 5
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Post by jelena on Sept 12, 2018 17:46:55 GMT
Hi we have two female degus.
On average they are both about one year and two months old. They used to be so very lovely towards each other however lately they have
not had the best approach with each other.
There has been constant scrapping this includes: >STRANGLING >BITING ON THE BACK AND ON THE NOSE >TRYING TO LOOK AT THE OPPOSITE GOOS BOTTOM >SQUEAKING AND SHREAKING
We separated them on september the 10th. today the 12th of september they were reunitied , however one degu wanted
the chase the other degu out and tried to cause kios leading another degu in distress they have now been separated once again.
i do not know what i can do please leave feedback TIA x
(MIRANDA-BROWN) (BARABRA-WHITE AND GREY)
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Post by misscatafer on Sept 12, 2018 19:17:00 GMT
Welcome! I think it would be best if this was started in a fresh thread so it is easier to follow. Please can you tell us about their setup: what cage are they in? how often do you clean them out and how? how much and what do you feed them? Do they have any time out of the cage and how has this affected their behaviour? Has their been any recent changes to the household or environment such as noises, new people, smells etc?
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jelena
Newborn Degu
Miranda and Barabra our two cheecky girl goos
Posts: 5
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Post by jelena on Sept 13, 2018 16:03:21 GMT
misscatafer Hi i have taken in your recent questions, I have found the answers this includes: Feeding:The two goos eat approximately 10g of vatakraft menu vital per day. Cleaning:We put them both in a spare cage , and we all help to clean the cage ,this happens every 2 weeks , we give them a sand bath once a week. Cage:They have been living in a Skyline negarium marrakesh 100 2046 rodent hutch. Handling:we aim to give the two degus a handling for about one hour per day. There also has been a slight room differentiation as we gave them more space for handling. Any idea to whee the issue may occure. x
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Post by savvy on Sept 13, 2018 16:31:52 GMT
Welcome to the forum!
Can we have some more details on how you clean their cage? If you clean too deeply, you remove all their hierarchy scent markers and effectively reset them back to zero. This means they fight to establish who is top degu, you clean the cage again, it gets reset to zero, so they fight again. And so it continues.
Also can you please give us the dimensions of your cage, it's not one I'm familiar with.
Many thanks!
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Post by ntg on Sept 13, 2018 16:36:59 GMT
Hi Jelena, so there's a few potential issues: A) although the cage you have probably seems huge, the size is quite small for degus unfortunately. For a pair you're looking at something that has three full size levels in those dimensions (think 3 stacked on top of one another). Most people here use the aventura cage from little pet warehouse, the double rodent cage from pet planet, the largest cage available from cozypets or the Savic Royal Suite (either standard or XL). B) dust bath - do you notice them squabbling more when they've either had a dustbath or it's being put in? I tend to leave the dustbath in the cage as that way they don't see it as a luxury item to fight over since we have seen fights triggered over the dustbath in the past. The one left in the cage at all times gets weed in, stuff buried in it etc so I just make sure I have a second for when they're out the cage too and then recycle the dust from outside to the inside of the cage once one needs changing. C) clean out - if you take all the substrate out at once and do a deep clean then it can remove all their scents, and with it dominance cues. This can often lead to fighting as they try and reestablish the pecking order since they rely quite heavily on smell. D) handling - how is the handling done? Do you have a playpen/secure room they run around in together or do you do it one at a time? Is the fighting increased when they're out as opposed to when they're inside or vice versa? We often see one of two patterns with fighting if cage size is a factor, either they fight more inside the cage and are fine outside the cage or they vent their frustrations once they get out. If they fight when they're out and they're both kept together without separation of any form then it's likely to be cage size related. If they do have separate handling then try letting them out both together as that should ease the tension. E) food/other resources such as wheel etc - do you have more than one bowl or do they share? If you have two, where are they both located in relation to each other, side by side or far apart? Is it 10g of food per day total or per degu? Do they have a wheel, preferably two or one large enough for both to run together? Generally degus do not like to share; they're the "Joey doesn't share food" of the animal world so plenty of food in two locations that are at least 30cm apart from each other, preferably not even in line of sight is important if they're really food aggressive. F) a combination of 1 or all of the above - they're complicated animals, sometimes they just really don't like the other goo for whatever reason, maybe the other ones like that really annoying person in your life that just grates on you but you can't get rid of. Except with degus they are living with that person, sleeping with that person and sharing food with that person. Finally, on a different note about the food - the vitakraft food is a muesli mix isn't it? If so then please comsider changing them onto a pellet ASAP as muesli mixes have been linked to dental disease in our small furries. Most people use the science selective degu pellets but a breakdown of the pellets available and pros and cons can be found here: deguworld.proboards.com/thread/17365/commercial-food-chart
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Post by misscatafer on Sept 13, 2018 16:48:05 GMT
OK, there are a couple of things which could be triggering the unrest. The viv is much too small for two degus unfortunately, they need three times the size of what they currently have - this is most likely why they are fighting as they don't have enough space. They need more than just degu pellets, and 10g doesn't sound enough. Do they have a bowl each and water bottle each so they are not fighting over food? Are they emptying the bowl each day or is there plenty at all times? Degus do not overeat, so it is best to keep two bowls with an unlimited supply so they do not get stressed out about running out of food. If you restrict food or let bowls empty, the alpha degu will stop the other degus eating - it is a survival instinct. They also need an unlimited supply of hay and need dried forage and seeds - you can look through the diet section on here to get more ideas. Degus do not actually like handling, what are you doing during this time, are you forcing them to be held for an hour a day or petting them in the cage on their terms? They are prey animals so will naturally not take kindly to being picked up etc and this could be causing distress. I understand why you are cleaning them out so often as the cage is so small, but are you leaving some old substrate in each time so they still have the smells? Degus rely heavily on scent marking to feel secure. They also need unlimited access to a sand bath, this should be in the cage at all times as this is a common item to fight over if restricted. I think if you make these changes you will see an improvement in their behaviour
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jelena
Newborn Degu
Miranda and Barabra our two cheecky girl goos
Posts: 5
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Post by jelena on Sept 14, 2018 17:00:35 GMT
thx to you all, so i will be buying some pallet and be giving thme more ,i have actually been considering getting a cage about 3 stories high so if the degus fight they may have places to get away but still in the same cage, i did actually shrub the cage deaply with out knowing it will get rid of the scent , (silly me) thx to you all i should hope fully see an improvement and keep imformed on the behaviour of Miranda and Barabara. THANKS
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Post by misscatafer on Sept 14, 2018 17:14:28 GMT
That is great news, looking forward to seeing how you get on and hearing more about Miranda and Barbara! We really like seeing pictures on here, never be afraid to ask questions as we are all here to help each other out
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jelena
Newborn Degu
Miranda and Barabra our two cheecky girl goos
Posts: 5
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Post by jelena on Sept 15, 2018 9:20:48 GMT
are degus meant to lie on the floor , almost like they are sleeping on the side?
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Post by ntg on Sept 15, 2018 9:56:45 GMT
How do you mean? A photo helps best in these situations - try uploading to something like postimages.org , click the share symbol underneath the image (3 dots connected by lines in a "<" shape) and use the thumbnail for forums url. I've seen degus do the weirdest things so it's likely that this is on the normal side of things for them. However, we do need a little bit more context when asking for advice as it's difficult to know what's going on from a single behaviour.
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Post by bouncy on Sept 15, 2018 11:11:41 GMT
Do you mean something like this? If so, perfectly fine and normal. The exposure of the belly shows they're comfy and don't feel threatened
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Post by winic1 on Sept 15, 2018 12:05:58 GMT
Can you wake them up? Will they get up and move?
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