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Post by moletteuk on Sept 3, 2018 18:47:02 GMT
Don't forget you need to urgently find out what sex Cha Cha is.
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Post by degucat on Sept 3, 2018 19:04:06 GMT
Don't forget you need to urgently find out what sex Cha Cha is. Yeah I really do!!!!! I’m finding it really hard as she won’t go anywhere near me lol The only way I think I’m going to to it is to try and take an action shot of her climbing up the side of the cage!
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Post by savvy on Sept 3, 2018 19:12:14 GMT
If you can get the photo from below, that would be great.
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Post by degucat on Sept 3, 2018 19:21:46 GMT
Ok I will try, it’s dark now and the rooms pretty dark but I will try and get an ok pic and if not I will try tomorrow 😀
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Post by deguconvert on Sept 3, 2018 21:31:02 GMT
That is exactly what and where you would see nipples.
Just so you know, if Cha Cha is male, THEY WILL do the deed as soon as the last pup is delivered. Tookie will be her most fertile at that point for for a few days following and her body will literally demand that she breed again . . . and Cha Cha will be VERY willing to oblige.
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Post by degucat on Sept 3, 2018 21:49:35 GMT
Ok! And thanks so u think I should separate him/ her anyway just in case as I can’t see what gender she/ he is, believe me I have tried for literally hours! 😂 And how long should I separate her for if she is pregnant and going to give birth? Should I go in and ask PAH to give me a new cage v soon?
Thanks everyone for all the help so far it is much appreciated 😀
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Post by degucat on Sept 3, 2018 21:51:06 GMT
Also about half an hour ago she was squeaking for ages but has stopped now. What do you think this means at this stage?
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Post by savvy on Sept 3, 2018 22:01:07 GMT
If Cha Cha is male you will need to separate them permanently or at least until 6 weeks after he has been neutered in order to avoid another pregnancy.
I would use the vet appointment tomorrow to confirm Cha Cha's gender. If he is male, then ask p@h for another cage, plus supplies. Also ask them to pay for his op and tell them you'll choose which vet you use.
Degus squeak for all sorts of reasons, fear, to get attention, to tell someone off, etc. Some even squeak in their sleep.
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Post by deguconvert on Sept 4, 2018 0:49:10 GMT
HEAR HEAR!!! Loudly seconding Savvy. Tookie's squeaks could also be indicating pain if she is labor or delivering. Or if there are pups already delivered, she could be greeting them.
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Post by degucat on Sept 4, 2018 6:34:19 GMT
😀 This morning I didn’t wake up to any babies but I looked at her chest again and I am definitely seeing round gaps of fur like in a rugby ball kind of shape (not with the point obvs lol) It’s kind of a bit rounded in near the front legs and a bit rounded in near the back legs But I can see them more clearly near her front and back legs! If any of that makes sense again lol 😂 Does this sound like it to you? Thanks 😊
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Post by savvy on Sept 4, 2018 8:40:25 GMT
Yep, that's her nipples! She's getting ready to feed the little ones when they arrive.
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Post by degucat on Sept 4, 2018 9:21:10 GMT
Ok! I went to PAH to speak to them and they said that she was just bloated because she’s in a new place and they said to cut out all nuggets etc.. and just feed her hay..... Is that right? I’m not so sure as I’m pretty sure she’s pregnant..... They haven’t even seen a pic of her!
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Post by moletteuk on Sept 4, 2018 9:47:37 GMT
Pets at home know nothing and will tell you anything. They often accidentally sell mixed sex pairs and pregnant females, but they aren't going to admit it to you until you have proof either from a vet or in the form of actual babies.
If you need the free cage before she gives birth you will have to have her checked by a vet, but this needs weighing up carefully since now you can see nipples we are fairly sure she is pregnant and taking her to the vet would be disturbing her.
If you can't get a look at Cha Chas genitals today, you should take him to the vet appointment you have for urgent sexing so you know if you need to separate them.
You have decisions to make but you need some solid information to make them.
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Post by savvy on Sept 4, 2018 9:59:14 GMT
As far as i know, if this was bloat, she would be quite ill by now. She has all the signs of being pregnant, plain and simple.
Pets at home are rubbish for advice on degus, even from their staff who claim to keep degus.
I'd be tempted to take a picture of the pups when they are born, take it into the shop and very loudly, and very publicly show it to the staff as evidence of the 'bloat' they diagnosed. But I'm quite vocal whenever I'm in there.
Your priority at the moment should be getting Cha Cha confirmed as either male or female as this impacts on what happens next.
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Post by ntg on Sept 4, 2018 11:34:04 GMT
I agree with the others - prioritise sexing Cha-cha first and foremost as this certainly isn't any bloat I've ever heard of... Unless you count carrying a bunch of pups inside you as bloat that is...
The other thing to prioritise is the cage you have - you're going to have to come up with a way to prevent the pups from getting to the other levels or the fall could seriously injure them. Removing the levels won't help as they'll just climb their way up the bars which could easily lead to a fall too. Remove the wheel once the pups are born too otherwise they can be seriously injured if they find themselves on the wheel when one of the adults start running on it.
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Post by degucat on Sept 4, 2018 14:58:39 GMT
Ok I will book an appt for tomorrow and use the tube technique and fingers crossed it works 🤞 I will baby proof the cage just in case. From all the symptoms how far off do u think she is? And should I carry on feeding her the nuggets etc.. even though the store colleague said not to? Thanks for everyone’s help so far! 😀
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Post by savvy on Sept 4, 2018 15:39:12 GMT
If her nipples are showing its a matter of days. She needs the nuggets now more than ever, she also needs hay and good quality forage and seeds as she will need extra nutrition to cope with birthing and then feeding the pups. Please take a look at our feeding chart for ideas on forage deguworld.proboards.com/thread/16425/degu-feeding-guide
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Post by deguconvert on Sept 4, 2018 15:43:24 GMT
Honey, they do not have a solid working knowledge of degus at the best of times. The rare employee that does is VERY rare indeed. Do not stop feeding her anything that she is happily eating! She needs all the fortification she can get for the task at hand.
I'm also going to strongly encourage you to supply a hut or something like a box turned upside down on the base level so that she can have some place to hide and be quiet. Your cage may seem as though there isn't room, but in her condition she will be feeling as though she is extremely vulnerable and exposed. She might even fight off her labor as much as she can for fear of the safety of her pups. THAT would be catastrophic!
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Post by winic1 on Sept 4, 2018 19:28:42 GMT
Hey Degucat, if her nipples have started showing, she could give birth any time now, even in just a few hours. So you have a few things that are really really necessary to get done, right now.
#1: Give her a hut. Find a small cardboard box, turn it upside down so it's like a little house, cut a door and a window in it. Or two doors. Just cut it as a hole, no flap. Give her plenty of nesting material--soft hay and toilet paper or something like that. No cloth or anything with threads. Put it on the bottom floor of the cage. That's where she's been preferring to stay, right?
#2: Remove the wheel. Babies get hurt on/under wheels. Remove the sandbath. It is dangerous to the new babies until they are a bit older.
#3: Divide your cage. Until you are SURE that Cha-Cha is female, you need to separate your degus. A mother degu commonly becomes pregnant again in the first few HOURS after giving birth. So, if she gives birth when you are asleep or not home, by the time you see you have babies, she could be pregnant again already. So, until you get Cha-Cha checked, they have to be separate. Tookie in the bottom, Cha-cha in the top.
#4: This one goes along with #3. Change your cage set up so the babies cannot get up to another level or shelf. Baby degus are like toddlers, little kids. They can walk. They can climb. But they're wobbly and unstable and have no sense of danger, and they WILL go up and then fall and then possibly die. So, leave Tookie on the bottom level with her nest and hut. Remove any ramp or shelves that go up to another level. Make the next level up SOLID, and complete, so that it divides the cage into two parts. You can design it with an access hole to the level below, so that in the future a ramp or shelves can be there, but for now, it has to be SECURELY BLOCKED so that no one can go up, no one can come down. And they can't get through however you block it, degus are tricky and determined. Cha-cha can live in the upstairs part of the cage until you find out whether you have a he or a she.
#5: Hoping you have a water bottle for them, not a water bowl. Babies can fall into and drown in a water bowl. If you don't already use a water bottle, you need to change. And you need one for each part of the cage and each degu, right? One for Tookie, one for Cha-cha. Now, if you are not already on a water bottle instead of a water bowl, tell us and we'll tell you how to teach your degus to use a bottle, it's not instinctive and you need to make sure they know how to drink from it.
#6: Don't take ANY advice from Pets at Home. They don't know what they're talking about, their business is to sell things and make money. So they will sell you all kinds of stuff that isn't right, because then they will sell you more stuff when you know better. They don't want to get stuck giving you vet care, another cage, and more stuff, for free because they made a huge mistake selling you a pregnant degu or two, so they are going to deny everything, make excuses up, and tell you anything they can think of to escape responsibility. If you are young, and/or not very good at arguing your case and standing up to people, you need to take a parent or friend who IS very good at debating and demanding, with you to argue for what they owe you because of their mistake. Since at this point taking Tookie to a vet may not be the best choice, you may just have to wait for the babies to appear. But it shouldn't be long, most likely not more than another week, I'd guess.
So, you have an immediate need to be prepared for babies. Once the prep is done, then you can work on improving their cage situation, battling Pets at Home, and figuring out what you are going to do with your degus and pups. If Cha-cha is a female, she could be pregnant, too, just not as far along. If male, then what do you want to do--two cages? Neuter?
But right now, you have to get things ready. Immediately. And find out if Cha-cha is female, and can remain with Tookie, or if male and needs to be separated right away.
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Post by degucat on Sept 5, 2018 6:46:28 GMT
Hi! Thanks for all the info on everything!😀
I will give her seeds, oats and nuggets plus hay and some branches and loo roll! I have added in a cardboard box with hay in (no printing on!) Is this ok? I will remove the wheel, and ladders. I have already got them a water bottle, does it matter it it’s quite big?
I understand that this is the time she needs food most and that’s why I didn’t believe the store college! Thanks again for all the advice and help so far!😀
(I will also wait for the babies if they appear! Before I take them to the vets!)
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