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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 10, 2017 15:03:38 GMT
Before yesterday, I've never heard of Degu's, but then my husband came home with one as a gift for me. I am familiar with exotics as I have a hedgehog which I've had for 4 years (got him as a baby from a certified breeder). My husband is pretty much distant in the care for my animals (we also have 2 rescue cats). He brought home a male, who is 2 months old, the only male of the litter he came from. He is a grey Degu, who've I've named Ludu (it means "Gray" in Welsh. I have strange names for all my pets) My husband said he would've gotten two as the vendor (it was at a swap meet and this vendor had exotic animals) said they do best in same sex pairs. But my husband's ignorance thought that 1 would be best for me because I have 1 hedgehog (which are natural loners, you never pair hedgies unless you want fighting or babies). So I did very fast research, to learn about them enough to give Ludu a temporary home (to protect it from our cats), some chew toys and housing, and food (hay and some no molasses chinchilla food). Needless to say, I am very unprepared to care for Ludu. With my hedgehog, I was on a 8 month waiting list, and throughout that I researched like crazy and had everything ready for him when he came home. I really worry about him being lonely, but I dont know if he can have another male degu from a different litter, let alone where to get one (I live in SE Mn) I am not mad at my husband as my hedgehog is really slowing down and I've recently been depressed about the prospect of him passing away. My husband thought a new, different, young pet would help me feel better. So here I am, no longer completely ignorant in degu's, but not very knowleged in pairing (as i worry about loneliness) and gaining Ludu's trust as well as helping him adjust to his new life. Any advice would be great.
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Post by ntg on Apr 10, 2017 15:21:41 GMT
Hi chihirolee3, and welcome to the world of degus! You'll find that they are a unique pet with weird habits very soon no doubt! You're right in thinking Ludu could do with a friend, and it doesn't have to be from the same litter but you do need to check for yourself that Ludu is indeed a he (and the same for any potential friends) as they're commonly missexed (details how are in the guide linked below). Check out the beginners guide if you haven't already: deguworld.proboards.com/thread/19754/beginners-guide-degu-keepingFirst things first - suitable cages. You want an all metal cage or a homemade one (wardrobe conversions can work well). A commonly used commercial cage is the Midwest Double Critter Nation cage with the plastic shelves changed for sheetwood (furniture board/melamine faced chipboard is best) edged with kiln-dried pine. You want a cage that is at least 100x50cm lxw with 3 full levels for when you find one or preferably 2 friends for him. Youll want to look at introductions too: deguworld.proboards.com/thread/17619/deguconverts-detailed-introductions-fighting-guideNext big thing is diet. We have loads of sticky threads in the diet section, but start with the feeding guide and then go from there: deguworld.proboards.com/thread/16425/degu-feeding-guideFeel free to ask any questions, no matter how weird they might seem. I can't stress it enough that degus are weird critters! Sorry, I somehow missed that you said you were from SE Minnesota, I'm not really fully functional today.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 15:35:33 GMT
Hi there! Please read through our beginners section and our diet section. Ludu definitely needs a friend. Definitely male unless you can find a spayed female. He's only a baby so introductions would be best ASAP. All degus until the age of 18 months go through an adolescence stage of fighting and being generally grumpy. Without a friend or two Ludu will get very depressed indeed. We strongly do not recommend having lone degus unless for a genuine reason (old old age and cage mates have died, bad illness etc). Degus need huge cages! That's because they cover lots of ground in the wild and we need to simulate that as much as possible in our home. We recommend the Aventura style cage or similar. I think in the USA you have the XL critter nation cage. www.amazon.com/MidWest-Critter-Nation-Animal-Habitat/dp/B001NJ0DAYIt's a great home for up to 2 degus if you leave it as it is. But if you have 3/4 degus then you need to make those half levels into full levels with some sheet metal, or some sheet wood. Kiln dried pine is the safest as it's safe for them to chew. However you can use other wood and then protect the edges with a band of kiln dried pine. Degus need wheels. The wheel needs to be 12inches in diameter as a minimum. www.tictacwheels.co.uk/metal-wheels tictac are great and do world wide shipping. The minimum you should get is 12 inches diameter and 4 inches deep, but the bigger the better. He and his future friends will need a dust bath. Use any tub, preferably one that's concealed with a hole for them to get in so you don't lose the sand. You need to use chinchilla sand. Most of us give our degus constant access to their sandbath as degus know when they need to bathe more than we know. He will need lots of wooden toys to chew, you can buy ledges made of wood to make your cage even better, branches, tunnels, tubes, hides.. there's lots of great things to do! If you go on "show us your cage" and look for winic1 her cage is amazing and she's from the USA. It'll give you lots of inspiration. Degus live around 8-15 years. They're extremely social and intelligent. They need lots of stimulation. An hour a day out to play is great if you can. We have guides on how to build playpens if you don't have a degu proof room. They will chew anything they can, so make sure you find an appropriate place to play. I'll link you to the guide when you say so. Diet wise, we feed our degus a mix of nuggets, hay, forage and seeds. I don't know what availability for all of the above is like where you are, so I'm sure someone who's more wise of your area will help you with where to buy from. If you look at our diet section, look at the forums feeding guide, the veg and seed guide, the bought forage mixes and safe plants and tree lists. They'll all be towards the top of the diet section. I'll link you later if you can't find it (I'm on my mobile and it creates mobile links and I'm unsure if they work). They need unlimited forage and hay. A teaspoon of seed mix. Nugget amount varies on the nugget. To hand train him, sit next to his cage for a few days until he's no longer scared of you, or ignores you. Talk to him, read a book out loud, that kind of thing. Then leave the cage door open and see what he does, after a while he won't be scared and will either want to explore you, or ignore you. Then offer treats at the edge of his cage, putting your hand in kind of violates his territory, oats or sunflower seeds are good for this purpose. Once he gets used to picking from your hand and doesn't run off, put your two hands together, and put the treats on the further away hand, or put them up your arm, so he has to get further on to you to eat. Eventually he'll stop running away with the treat and sit on you to eat. Or you could do all this within a play pen, so there's no chance of escape. Lie in the playpen with him with the cage door open, every day. Or sit. And have treats dotted about on you. You also should tube train him, we use cardboard tubes and it makes it easy to "catch" and transport as degus don't like being picked up as they're prey animals. If you do have to pick him up, do not do so from above, it'll scare him and make him flee. Tube is by far the easiest. Also please be aware degus aren't really cuddly pets, I don't know if hedgehogs are, but degus are more of a "sit and watch" kind of pet. Lone degus may become happy with accepting fuss. I have 3 lone degus who I'm introducing together and they all love fuss and cry for it. But this is because they aren't getting the attention from other degus and as a last resort turn to a human. So please don't keep him alone because you enjoy being able to fuss him, it's probably very tempting as I know how much I love fussing my three, but I also can't wait for them to live together and get their needs fulfilled by other degus! Ask away with any questions! That's what we are here for x
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Post by winic1 on Apr 10, 2017 15:35:35 GMT
Since he is so young, it shouldn't be too hard to pair him up with another young one, if you can find one, or maybe an older one or two.
Keep an eye out on petfinder, hoobly, and craigslist. Sometimes they show up there.
Also, call around to local shelters that take in small animals--the ones that do guinea pigs and chinchillas and rabbits and hamsters. While they may not have any degus, they may know of someone who does. Networking works!
Last resort, you may be able to find a pet store who can order one in for you. Again, look for a store that handles exotics like chinchillas and ferrets.
Is there any way at all to track down the guy your husband got Ludu from? While he might not have any more young males, he may know of other degu people in the area.
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Post by ntg on Apr 10, 2017 15:59:27 GMT
Had a quick google and there's this rescue that doesn't look like it has degus in at the moment but might know where you could find some m.facebook.com/MNPocketPetRescue/A reddit post from a year ago also said they got degus from Twin City Reptiles who don't stock small mammals anymore but probably know where to get them.
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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 10, 2017 16:13:08 GMT
I sent a message to the pet rescue. I cannot find anything close to Mn as far as purchasing and picking up a degu. My husband got NO contacts for the vendor and the swap meet required no registration (its just a show up and sell kind) so i couldnt get any vendor information that way. I am hoping to buy a 6ft tall sugar glider cage from a local. i have spare 12in solid wheels for my hedgehog and plan to use them once i get a cage big enough. Poor thing seems very on edge. One of my cats went bezerk over his presence and really scared the poor guy. I moved his cage to our bedroom where the cats have zero access.
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 10, 2017 16:51:30 GMT
That's a shame you can't track down the vendor. Keep looking around. Without any litter mates, he's probably going to need a full introduction process anyway and somebody needed to take him on and do this, so at least he found a human who realises you can't keep them alone and also can't just throw other degus at them. I'm sure you can figure everything out for him with a little time.
Degus are runners and so need the cage to have a decent footprint, it should have a length of 100cm+ (40") or just a little less for commercial cages is acceptable. You may be able to lay your current cage on its side if it doesn't have the footprint.
To help him settle you can provide lots of hiding places all around the cage, even things like logs, cardboard boxes, plant pots, anything can serve as an impromptu hiding place to build up his confidence. I don't know what the temperatures are like with you, but he may also like a heatpad or safe cuddly toy to 'pile' with when he sleeps, until you find him a friend.
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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 10, 2017 17:06:40 GMT
Hedgehogs aren't really cuddly as they are prickly . With him, I let him sleep on my lap as I read. Thats about as cuddly as I get with him. Apparently the cage I was hoping to get got sold. So I am thinking of converting a bookshelf into a cage. He has 2 chewy logs to hide in and a Toilet paper tube. I researched into toys and bought a variety of things for him to help keep his lonliness at bay. I wish my husband got 2 females instead. I worry that I wont be able to get him a friend any time soon
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Post by winic1 on Apr 10, 2017 17:38:07 GMT
Does he have several places to hide? Even just take a tissue box or the like and cut out a door hole and a small window (my guys prefer a second exit type hole). He needs to feel that he has several safe "burrows" to retreat into when things get scary.
And right now, EVERYTHING is scary. All the sounds, smells, background noises, the voices, the people, everything in his world has changed. AND....there's a big scary degu-eating predator lurking about. And he's all alone, no family anymore. He has a lot to adjust to.
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Post by zenaida on Apr 10, 2017 17:38:53 GMT
Try not to fret too much if you can't find a friend right away. It is harder here in the states than it is in the UK. It took me something like a month of searching to find my girls (with some exploratory looking before that). I almost drove 5 hours one way to Montreal to adopt some girls, but it fell through only for me to find my crew in a city 45 minutes away. Plus the lady I adopted them from was thrilled that I was taking "a big group" off her hands so she has less mouths to feed at her rescue.
Get him settled, but keep an eye on various networks (craigslist, petfinder, etc) for a friend for him. It is a situation where the sooner the better to find a friend because he is young and would be easier to introduce, but you can only do what you can right now. You could be surprised the strange way finding a friend may come together.
Also, don't worry if he is on edge a little right now, it is a hard transition for him. My girls came home about 2 weeks ago, they hid for the first 2 days and stayed only on one level of the 4 levels available to them. Over the next week they slowly started exploring and getting more comfortable. They will always still jump at movement and sound, but they will be more curious and get used to movements and sounds in the home. Now at the two week mark, I just had to do some work on their cage and I couldn't "chase" them up to the top levels to block off the lower levels for work. They trust me too much that they were all coming down to see what I had for them. Instead I had to catch them each in a tube and put them on the top levels. Anyway, give him some space and time, but also let him get to know you, how you sound, and how you move. He'll get comfortable.
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Post by winic1 on Apr 10, 2017 17:41:15 GMT
Check the ingredients of the chewy logs. Usually they are NOT degu-safe, as they are made with starchy ingredients, and starch becomes sugar as it is digested. They sell them with degus on the list of animals they are suitable for, but usually not. In fact, don't believe anything a pet store or pet supply website tells you about degus here. Most of it is dead wrong. (like, for example, exoticnutrition.com is about as wrong as can be on everything. They sell yogurt covered raisins as good degu treats!)
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Post by winic1 on Apr 10, 2017 17:46:59 GMT
Hoping we're not overwhelming you.
We just get so excited when there's someone new, and we want to help, and suddenly you have so many people telling you this and that and ...... we mean to be friendly, there's just so much to say that we get carried away sometimes...
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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 10, 2017 18:06:17 GMT
I do not feel overwhelmed by all the replies at all. I am very glad to actually have a smart phone now (just upgraded from a flip phone last week.) If i didnt have this and things transpired the way they did, I wouldn't be able to do anything about Ludu until Wednesday. I live very rural and do not have internet at home and only get to the public library on Wednesdays (due to my work hours). I am overwelmed more by the sudden-ness of my situation more than anything. The more I learn from experianced Degu owners, the more I can be a better parent to Ludu. Btw, he is definately a male. His "parts" are spread pretty far apart after looking into the sexing of Degus
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Post by savvy on Apr 10, 2017 19:27:34 GMT
It will take him time to settle and learn to trust you, please don't worry if he doesn't straight away, it can take a few weeks, maybe even months. His whole life has changed and he needs time to adjust.
He will need a degu friend as no matter how much love and affection we can given them, we are not degus, nor can we speak their language. A rolled up pair of socks will give him something to snuggle up. He will also need lots of wood to chew, we have a list of safe woods and foods on here in the diet section. Please, please check all and every ingredient in commercial degu food as they sometimes contain foods that are not good for them.
There are various techniques you can try to help him trust you, but in the meantime you need to give him a couple of days to settle in.
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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 10, 2017 22:57:09 GMT
When buying stuff for him yesterday, i REALLY focused my research on diet, as the one thing my husband remembers is that they ate prone to diabetes and thus should have as little sugar as possible in their food/treats and chewables. My hedgehog needs a finicky diet too, as they need little fiber (they are insectavores), so I very much umderstand the importance of a proper diet. Ludu will be even less happy if he isnt healthy.
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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 11, 2017 3:23:17 GMT
That is a great idea! I grow my own sunflowers so having them raw and unsalted would be better than bhying some roasted or in bird seed mix. I also grow my owm brocolli and many other vegis in my garden. I am what you'd call a "lazy gardener." Outside of weeding, diseases, and tomato splitting, i just let nature do its thing. Of course I have everything as erganomic as possible with rain barrels and a 3 stage composting system. Also planning to get chickens to help keep pests down amd have home fresh eggs. But this is a tangent....Im just happy that i can share my bounty with a new little friend.
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Post by moletteuk on Apr 11, 2017 10:24:48 GMT
The most important diet item is forage, you are probably going to have to use some ingenuity to source a selection in USA, probably do some picking your own, maybe careful choices of some leafy veg, things like carrot tops/leaves. Second thing is to source the best commercial food you can get hold of, look for grass content, low grain content, good calcium levels, low phosphorus level.
Sunflower seeds and millet and oats are really just treats for taming. Seeds for adding nutritional value tend to mostly be high calcium ones like black mustard, dill, fennel, celery, coriander, cumin, sesame, poppy, (also linseed), which you should be able to find in an asian supermarket or health food shop.
But forage like herbs, tree leaves, safe garden and veg plants, hedgerow and meadow plants, flowers is the main thing!
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Post by savvy on Apr 11, 2017 12:49:51 GMT
Sorry if I wasn't clear re the millet oats and sunflower seeds, they're for hand training, or one of the three types once a week as a little treat if they've been good. The ingredients moletteuk has listed are what the rat rations daily degu seed mix is made of, so if you can't order from there that's how you'd make your own! I've spoken to ratrations recently and unfortunately they are not allowed to ship orders from outside the European Union due to import restrictions, any overseas orders are automatically destroyed by customs due to the nature of the product.
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Post by chihirolee3 on Apr 11, 2017 13:51:27 GMT
I got Timothy hay for his main food. I got Vita Smart chinchilla food. Saw no molassas or other sugars. Protein 17%, Fat2.5%, fiber 15%. Im giving him a couple pieces a day as i do not know his previous diet, and i dont want him to get sick from food transitioning.
As far as chewy toys go, I'm at a loss there. Outside of the types of rope in bird toys, I never found ingrediant lists on the toys. The only thing they say is the color is "safe." A pet store worker said most toys are made if pine. The joys of living in the US, even the ingrediants of human food is purposfully vague (just 'sugar' can mean anything from HFCS to sugar beet as an example).
I got a cheap metal cake pan and some chinchilla dust so he can have a dust bath later this week (i dont want to overwhelm him). Ive been sitting near his cage as i read and type so he can get used to my presence.
I decided to order a cage. I got a very large 3 tier (with a floor) cage, planning on 2 degu. I am going to ultimately put the Degus in our bedroom so the cats cannot torment them and our bedroom is the only climate controlled room in the house. During summer, our house gets in the 90F (32 C) and in the winter our home stays at 58F (15 C).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2017 14:16:19 GMT
Could you show us the cage you've ordered? You may struggle with them in the bedroom as they are surprisingly noisy. With a wheel, chewing, running around and talking, it gets incredibly noisy when you're trying to sleep. You may want to find something enclosed for a bath, as when he baths you will lose most of the dust over the sides if you're using a cake pan. They can chew anything as long as its kiln dried pine or natural safe branches (you can find safe branches from our list). Did you take a look at winic1 cage for inspiration? She lives in the US and I'm so envious of her cage despite having a better access to things than my US counterparts! Degus really need things to chew on to keep their teeth down. We do have a few US members and I think they fair fine, so perhaps they'll help you. Timothy hay isn't a main food, they should always have access to it, unlimited, but forage is the most important aspect of their diet. Mine don't eat very much hay at all because of the access they have to forage, they mainly use the hay to make nests with now.
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