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Post by randomname on Feb 7, 2017 21:47:48 GMT
Been doing a little research on sand types. Seems to be some mutterings that quartz sand is a carcinogenic. It seems to definitely be in humans. Some people are avoiding it for their small animals health. Sepiolite seems to be safe, although some chin owners are saying it's not sharp enough to penetrate the coat to clean it sufficiently. Anyone else seen these debates? What do you think? Safe for chins? Safe for degus? Am looking at ordering a 20kg bag of Sepiolita so I'd like your input before I do.
Also does any one use blue cloud? (which I believe is a pumice) (mainly chin people) I have used a half scoop on top of the sand in the bath occasionally & it seems to really bring out a lovely shine to the coat, is anyone aware of any dangers or positives to using it?
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Post by charliekhris on Feb 7, 2017 21:55:30 GMT
I did not know there are different bathing sands, nor that there are different benefits from them! I will be following this thread closely! (We only have the pah chinchilla sand - no idea what kind that is)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2017 22:00:07 GMT
Nor did I charliekhris do I feel like a degu noob now or what! I'm gonna go see what's in the sand I use.
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Post by randomname on Feb 7, 2017 22:19:25 GMT
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Post by Emziedee on Feb 8, 2017 0:24:09 GMT
Interesting. I too use both the zooplus ones interchangeably and am now using the PAH one. I must say, the PAH one doesn't give them a glossy coat like the zooplus one does!
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Post by darthchinchi on Feb 8, 2017 13:27:01 GMT
I just go with a sand that feels right. If it's too sharp it damages the hair. Too fine and you will end up with dusty white animals As far as I remember it's Sepiolite our farmers use, and I normally by of off them as it's way cheaper than anything I can get online. It's 10-15 pounds for a 20kg bag as far as I remember.
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Post by moletteuk on Feb 8, 2017 14:29:33 GMT
I looked into this once for somebody. Sepiolite is magnesium silicate and is made up of a range of particle sizes, blue cloud is a very fine dust of aluminium silicate. I think the blue cloud is sourced in america and is popular over there for chins. Do chins have a special way to close off their nose so they don't inhale the dust? Often, any substance in a very fine dust can harm the lungs of any animal.
I think the sepiolite and blue cloud products are clays and so are better at absorbing excess oils, the sand products may be better at sloughing off old skin cells but may be harsher on the skin.
I tend to use a mix of the PAH one, which is sepiolite and a sandier one either from a local independant shop or I think Vitakraft or Versele Laga from the Range for my goos.
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Post by deguconvert on Feb 8, 2017 17:31:29 GMT
Blue cloud is what I used most often, but that now gives me concern after reading what you say, Moletteuk, that it is a very fine aluminium silicate. Aluminium in products for humans, such as deodorant/antiperspirant are linked to cancers in the body, such as breast cancer. So I'm thinking that such a fine powder that may possibly be being inhaled into the lungs, must also be a potential hazard. For the animals that use it and the people that own them.
I really liked how shiny it made them . . . but with the above question in my mind . . . not so sure it is worth it?
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Post by moletteuk on Feb 9, 2017 11:00:17 GMT
Silica dust causes silicosis too in humans.
I think the Blue Cloud is very widely used in America so there can't be a huge problem (?). I'm pretty sure I read that chinchillas at least have this mechanism to close off their airways while they bathe, because they always say that hamsters should have only bathing 'sand' because they can't close off their airway to cope with the dust like chins can. I don't know how degus fit into this.
It seems accepted that chins and possibly degus should have one of the clay products, so if there is a choice available, I would go with the product with the larger particles, which would be the sepiolite.
...I just thought about talc, which is a form of magnesium silicate, so very similar to the sepiolite, which does indeed have some suspicions over it for lung damage, but given the rates of usage and the relatively small amounts of problems, I would still go with the sepiolite over the blue cloud.
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Post by randomname on Feb 9, 2017 12:13:45 GMT
I usually use a bath full of sepeolite or quartz, then i add half a scoop of blue cloud once a week. I couldn't afford to use blue cloud as the whole bath! darthchinchi - mine are both white, so I don't mind dusty white chins The best deal I can find is 20kg Sepiolita so if that seems safe. I'll go with that. I can buy a tub of blue cloud to add occasionally when I next get paid. I know sepiolite is used to make pipes for people to smoke, so I imagine if there was a health concern generally about meerschaum we would know. Quartz seems cheaper, but I can't find it in bulk. It does feel sharper, but I don't see any better coat for using it over sepeolite.
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Post by darthchinchi on Feb 9, 2017 12:24:15 GMT
I know of bluecloud but never used it. Problem with too fine sand is you still get with looking chins if they are white.
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Post by randomname on Feb 9, 2017 13:12:48 GMT
The only difference i see with blue cloud is that the coat is fluffier on the chins. Doesn't make much difference for the degus. I only use a couple of tablespoons mixed in with their (cheaper) sand though.
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