Help! my degu is dying!

[aday3686]

Hello everyone I'm here again with bad news about Kokoro's best friend, Sora. It is quite complicated to explain but I'll do my best.

2 weeks ago my female degu Sora had something like an infection in both eyes. Many times a day she had snots, pus or sleeps in the eyes, I don't know exactly. I start to wash her eyes with chamomile tea for 5 days. It seems to get better but doesn't disappear so I try with eye drops and finally it get totally heal. All along of this problem I started to notice that when Sora ate she cut up the food and it is like she can't put the food into her mouth, in the very beginning I didn't care because she looks well. But over time she start to lose weight and continues to cut up the food, I didn't alarm because she was well. Suddenly I noticed a little thing that I didn't see at the first time, every time I give her vegetables (She didn't like it before) she continue to cutting it up but she tried to eat. Little by little she gave up eats her diary degu food and always she was waiting for vegetables although she can't eat them. Finally, today she was very bad, she didn't want to move, I gave her favorite food and she didn't like it, and I eventually decided to gave her vegetables and she came running to eat the although she continue to cutting it up. Is obvious that she is very hungry but something doesn’t let her to eat. We tried to watch her mouth but it was normal. We decided to give her smashed food with water and unbelievable she eats it. But it seems like she can't eat too much despite of she is very hungry.

I hope to have explained myself; maybe the eyes problem has nothing about it. Here you have a photo so you can see how she cut up the food.

Please, I need help, she is very weak, and I will thank any suggestion

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[aday3686]

Here is another photo.

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[smux]

At a guess, it may be the same problem that got my Elsevier...he had problems eating near the end and got weaker and weaker. A trip to the vet told us that his food reserves (a pouch in the back of the mouth or throat, it may be more than one pouch as I don't remember) were empty and he had an abcess in his jaw (I could feel a lump under his mouth, directly on the jaw) and because of this he was too weak to be operated on so they gave me special food to help nurse him back to health with. Sadly it was too late for him, but if you get yours to the vet as soon as possible and let them check out her pouch and feel her jaw gently for signs of an abcess (something you can do, of course...you'll notice a lump that you don't notice in your other degu) and hopefully if they find something they'll be able to x-ray her and confirm it then operate same-day to remove it. This may not be the problem, but it is one that can be common in degus and I think it usually happens when degus don't get enough wood to chew on or if they don't chew on enough wood. My Elsevier got wood sticks often but he preferred to hide them rather than chew on them most of the time and there were times when none of the degus had any sticks to chew on for a while.

The not eating is definitely a symptom in my opinion.

If you have a syringe in the house (unlikely, but in my case I have a few from when another of my degus was getting medicine regularly) then you could liquidise some vegetables (using a blender or something similar) and feed it to her directly into her mouth going past her teeth...this is basically what I was doing on the day before he died, although as I said it was special food I was given rather than me having to prepare food for him.

[aday3686]

Thanks for the fast reply. My degu, Sora, still eat by her own. But she throws more than the half to the floor (as you can see in the photo). She always has chewed a lot, and in fact this morning when I saw her teeth they were perfect (obviously I wasn't able to see her molars). Later I will search for lumps in the jaw.

I will keep you informed.

[aday3686]

bad news, we found a lump under the jaw. She is very bad, she doesn't move practically.

[smux]

If she is still eating something, it's not so much of a worry...Elsevier did eat some food but only because he was hungry and knew he had to eat something, your girl might be doing the same and braving any pain she is in while eating. It may be nothing, but it may be this or something else. An abcess is under the tooth and it may be in the early stages so her teeth will look fine, but you may notice this will change in the future and that is when you need to act fast.

In the case of Elsevier, he was always a messy eater and threw food around in the search for the bits he liked, so it wasn't as easy for me to spot he hadn't been eating as much as he should have been, and he had always been slim compared to his brother so I never took any notice of weight issues. Also, the 3 girlies I have (the ones listed in my signature as unnamed although they do now have names...just getting used to telling them apart before I edit it) have always been slight (small) and they're in good health so I haven't paid much attention to weight differences among my degus (although I am trying to fatten the girlies up a little at the moment by treating them over Christmas with regular bits of Christmassy nuts and large sunflower seeds).

[aday3686]

It could be an abscess, I don’t think that we have time; it looks like she lose weight every minute. I think she is dying of starvation.

[aday3686]

Kokoro who lives with Sora has an eye like Sora 5 days ago, with sleeps or snots. This is worrying I don’t know if there is any connection.

[smux]

The co-morbid (related to each other) symptoms you mention are not something I know much about, hopefully someone else will know better than me and will post soon. I would probably reconsider treating Koko's symptoms just in case.

I am not recommending this, but a look online (through google) found deguworld.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=gotopost&board=health&thread=343&post=2883 which mentions infections and pinkeye and a natural remedy for it. One thing mentioned is to put some camomile tea into their water as it is (as you know) a natural antibiotic and may help with any infections.

Obviously the best thing to do is to take them both to a vet, anything any of us says is based 100% on our own experiences and what you tell us...there may be vital things we're not asking or you're not saying that would give someone a clue as to what the problem is, and a vet will be able to look and feel in all the right places and run all the tests they need to in the course of determining what the problem is, a vet can also take drastic action to prolong their lives by ensuring they have the required fluids and putting them on a drip if necessary.

[aday3686]

The worst thing is that I live in Spain, exactly in the Canary Island, in a tiny island, and the first time we saw a degu was 5 years ago. When I had problems with Kokoro’s teeth I visited many vets and ALL OF THEM didn’t know what a degu was. So bringing Sora to the vet is not the best option because I know more about this animal than a vet, it is very sad. Here the vets only know about cats and dogs so Sora is forsaken.

[nickymills30]

i hope your little girl improves xxx

[smux]

A holiday to the mainland is in your future, I believe. If she hasn't got worse, you may have time to get second opinions from other members of the forum...but once she gets worse you have VERY little time before she is too ill to be operated on if it is an abcess. A lump under the jaw, previous tooth issues (which I totally forgot about and didn't include in my "diagnosis"), issues with eating...it all leads me to abcess, although granted I don't have much experience for it to lead me elsewhere but nothing says it isn't an abcess to me. Hopefully someone else can give a different diagnosis.

[puzzle29]

I would take her to the vet as soon as possible, and they will probably be able to do something. This happened to my degu puzzle, but he was so weak we couldn't do anything. It's a good thing you noticed it early, and btw I hope she gets better x

[aday3686]

This morning she seems to be like yesterday not worse neither better. She gets out of the bead and didn’t want to eat her vegetables. Tomorrow I will get her to the vet although I think that get her to the vet is not a good thing. I am absolutely sure that the vet would not be able to heal her, and any medicine the vet could give her is going to kill her because she is very weak now.
I have a new hypothesis; this morning when I clean the cages, I noticed that in their bed they could have feel cold, because they haven’t done the bed very well. Maybe she has a strong flu although she nose is dry.

[aday3686]

Hello everyone. I want thank you all of your advices but Sora died this morning in the vet. The vet said that she maybe has a lump under her jaw but it was too late, she was too weak to operate, so we put her to sleep.

Rest in peace Sora. Thanks smux for you help, you were very useful.

Sora we will always remember you, with love Aday and Rebeca.

[smux]

Then it was as I thought, an abcess...they claim the lives of too many rodents (although degus aren't specifically rodents, I group them in with rodents in this case as it is a problem that degus have in common with rodents) and I advise that people learn to regularly check their degus chins for lumps. If you find a lump, don't panic straight away and run to the vet (although it is a good idea to catch it as early as possible), and instead have someone else (doesn't matter who, just someone you can ask) confirm the diagnosis. The lump feels like a bit of bone, which is why it is hard to spot if you're not looking specifically for it, and it is also why I mistook it for a swelling from a fall in my Elsevier. Once you have confirmed that it is likely to be an abcess, the vet will need to x-ray your degu (for which they will need to be put under anaesthetic, I mention this because both the x-ray and the anaesthetic is going to cost money and also because if your vet isn't in the know about degus you are going to have to tell them about the fact that they need a specific mixture and the information on this is on degutopia) and once it's confirmed they will need to be operated on (again requiring anaesthetic).

If the lump isn't noticed early, the next symptom is usually lethargy (always a sign that something is wrong) brought on by weakness from not eating food, and it is at this stage (as Aday now knows) that it can be too late for treatment and the degu will quickly degenerate into the stage from which there is no going back. A competent vet will not operate on an animal that is too weak to survive the operation, and this is why it should be caught before the later symptoms show themselves as you otherwise have to strengthen the degu up with regular feedings and such before the vet can do anything.

Hey, be thankful I'm not trying to get you all to save your degus from testicular cancer, we all know where you'd have to be feeling for lumps on a regular basis :-P

Lastly, Aday...go with this advice if you will, ignore if you wish, but in future it would be a good idea to have pets that "fit in" with the support you can gain from your local vets. Once the time comes that Rebecca goes to meet Sora, I would personally find a different type of pet to have that can be treated by the vets in your area if the need arises. Obviously, you may want to ignore that advice because you love degus, and feel free to do so as it's just me talking logically and love is never logical, but I don't think you would want to have to go through all this again with more degus. Sometimes the most loving thing you can do for an animal is the opposite of what you want to do, just like having Sora put to sleep this morning. Saying all that, it does sound like you have adapted to the fact that the vets are no use to you, You've found ways of treating most of the illnesses and problems you have faced, but if the problem is more than you can handle then you have little or no options for treatment. It isn't irresponsible to get more degus, but I personally wouldn't do so if I was in your circumstances :-)

[aday3686]

I know that it is very difficult to have degu without the support of a specialized vet. But we really love our pets and we will try to do our best always. I know that the situation is not the best but to love this animal is something that we can't avoid.

I have to say that Rebeca is my girlfriend, and Kokoro was Sora's best friend. Kokoro and Sora were our first degus and the became inseparable. Nowadays we have 5 degus, our 5 little princess. And now you are trying to Kokoro don't get depress, because of this Kokoro have a new partner since yesterday, Miki a shy little girl.

Finally I want you to know that Sora has been my first dying degu and We couldn't forget her. She was 4 years old. I post a photo here as a memento.

This photo was taken 3 days ago. My little Sora we miss you.

[nickymills30]

sorry to hear of you loss xx

[smux]

And sorry, I meant Koko, dunno why I said Rebecca...you know what I meant though :-)

You'll never forget your first loss, as you know...it gets easier, but you will remember all sorts of things they did and that you'll not see them do it again...but it does get easier with time.

Also, it is difficult for everyone to get quality care for their degus, we have the same problem as you when it comes to vets but there are some with a bit more experience in some cases...we can go to the basic vets for basic illnesses that are common across rodents, but have to watch out that they do things right

[deguconvert]

Aday, I am so sorry about Sora!! I've been out of town the past four days, so have missed all that was happening. I am so sorry for your loss!! Poor little Sora, and poor Kokoro. I hope Kokoro and Miki will bond with each other. I understand your grief, and will be thinking of you and Rebeca.