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Post by michele23 on May 27, 2011 15:18:29 GMT
Okay, so this forum censors the technical term for this problem, but my degu Pumpkin has an issue with his genitals prolapsing. Basically it just hangs out and he can't seem to get it back in. He is currently 6 years old and this is the only health problem he has ever had. (For the record, his brother Honeydew had the same thing happen to him once, I posted about it here in Feb. 2010- the vet thinks it might be something in the gene pool). Anyhow, Pumpkin has had this happen 4 times in the last year, 3 of which were THIS MONTH. Each time we tried to gently put it back in ourselves (Soak it, remove any hair and use vaseline to try and push it back in) to no avail. So off to the vet we went each time, and each time they had to put him under anesthetic and push it back then stitch it closed with just a tiny opening. The first time worked great and lasted 11 months. The next 2 times it fell back out a couple days after the stitches were removed. And the last time (just last week) they decided to try stitching the urethra to the prepuce (the inners to the outers basically) with the hope that it would form scar tissue that would keep it from coming out again. In short, it didn't work and fell back out again yesterday. So 5 times total. 4 times this month. 4 weeks in a row  We had talked about what we would do if this kept happening, as the surgery seems to only be a temporary 1 week-ish solution each time. He finds it distressing to go through, and also it is really expensive ($250 each time minimum). We've spent over $1000 on this problem which seems a bit crazy. We hate to put him to sleep when he seems otherwise healthy: eating, drinking, playing. So when this happened yesterday we decided to just leave it as long as he does not seem distressed. We already know that another trip to the vet is unlikely to work more than a week (when the stitches come out it falls out). Anyhow, it is almost 24 hours later, and it looks the same (no swelling, I think the outer part has been stretched so much from the surgeries), it's just pink and hanging out. The cage is lined with paper so we can tell if he's urinating. He is. He is eating and drinking, and seems okay, but a bit less playful than usual. Every now and then he tries to "fix" it but obviously it doesn't work. The vet thinks the muscles are too weak to hold it in place. I'm hoping that he'll get used to it hanging out and it will stop bugging him, or that maybe we can magically get it back in somehow...another trip to the vet is tempting to me, but we feel that we have to know when to stop...we feel it's not fair to him to go through surgery every week, and also we can't really continue to afford $250 a week. If we notice he's really not happy, we've talked about putting him to sleep, I just hate to do it because he's our last one and seems healthy otherwise Any advice would be welcomed. |
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Post by deguconvert on May 28, 2011 5:37:05 GMT
NO!! I think the medications in that cream could cause him great injury. I think as Smux says, keeping it clean and the area clean is your priority. I would also be using gentle lubricants for him that will keep it moist and slippery enough to move back in as it heals. I think that perhaps he has a muscle injury, rather than simply a loss of muscle strength, and as his muscles rest and heal you should see his member slowly withdrawing back into his body. At this point, hope the very best for him, and don't subject him to another surgery. Give him time to heal, until you begin to see clear signs of trouble increasing rather than decreasing. It is my hope that this will not happen and he will turn fully around.
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Post by michele23 on May 28, 2011 9:10:01 GMT
He seems to be doing about the same, maybe a little better. Last night he was playing more (chewing wood, dragging things around his cage). He has a large cage which we're lining with sheets of white paper (like I said in my previous post because it's cleaner and we can make sure he's able to urinate) and we clean the cage every night. We're also keeping the prolapse clean and lubricated (the only downside to the lubrication is more stuff sticks to it!). It still seems to bug him, as we see him try to put it back in every now and then, to no avail. I hope you're right Deguconvert, and that it is just a muscle injury that will heal. Anyhow, we are hoping for the best and I'll keep you updated on the happenings.
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Post by kovu07 on May 28, 2011 9:11:41 GMT
I hope it all works out, it doesn't sound like much fun for the poor little guy. |
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Post by michele23 on May 30, 2011 18:26:35 GMT
So Pumpkin seems about the same still, since the prolapse last happened, (eating, drinking, chewing on wood occassionally, coming out for scratches, not jumping around as much and trying to 'fix' the prolapse at times). This morning I noticed that it looks even more prolapsed though, almost like the sheath turned inside out a bit. Sigh. I really don't know what to do besides what we're doing. This is stressful though.
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Post by moletteuk on May 30, 2011 19:05:33 GMT
I would think the chance of infection or other damage is quite high if it doesn't go back in soon Did you try asking Chloe at degutopia for advice, I would think she's your best chance of someone with direct knowledge of this problem? |
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Post by michele23 on May 30, 2011 19:40:42 GMT
I just emailed Chloe again....she never responded to the message I sent a few weeks ago....so we'll see if she answers I guess. I'm so worried about him, I really don't know what to do.
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Post by kovu07 on May 30, 2011 19:45:08 GMT
I really hope she replies, since I don't think many of this forums members have experienced this problem. |
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Post by michele23 on May 30, 2011 19:45:56 GMT
me too |
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Post by kovu07 on May 30, 2011 19:46:37 GMT
keep us updated, please |
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Post by michele23 on May 30, 2011 19:47:12 GMT
I'm half contemplating another trip to the vet's, but I'm not really sure what that would accomplish since we've already done that 4 times this month...
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Post by kovu07 on May 30, 2011 19:50:16 GMT
I see where your coming from it seems silly in a way to go back to the vets when you know what they'll say, is there another vets you could take him to? Since the advice given by this vet hasn't had the desired affect.
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Post by deguconvert on May 30, 2011 20:09:57 GMT
Michele23, where in Canada are you located? You can PM me that info if you are not inclined to make it public. We have an exotic pets hospital in Calgary that maybe I can call and ask if they have a list of associates or if they know of other vets in your area that can help you.
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Post by michele23 on May 30, 2011 20:46:02 GMT
Deguconvert, I'm in Halifax nova scotia- we've been to 3 different vets about this and they've ll done the surgery, but unfortunately the effects were not long lasting and none are sure what else to do. That would be great if you could try and find anything out for me though....I would appreciate it.
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Post by deguconvert on May 31, 2011 2:52:40 GMT
OK . . . they'll be closed now, but I'll see what I can find out tomorrow.
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Post by moletteuk on May 31, 2011 18:52:38 GMT
I've put a message for Chloe's urgent attention on the degutopia forum, hopefully we might get a response.
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Post by michele23 on May 31, 2011 19:07:26 GMT
Okay so....we have an appointment at the vet for 6:20....in a couple of hours. The sheath has just gotten so red and swollen, it looks really sore And his poor little thing drags on the ground behind him when he walks. He can't run on his wheel because of it. He's also not urinating very much now...only about 1 pee in 24-30 hours. I can't tell if he's in pain or not (I have been giving him metacam) but it definitely looks very sore. I know he's frustrated because he keeps trying to fix it, which i think might be making it worse. I don't even know why I made a vet appointment, because I already know my 2 options there....either attempt the surgery again for the 5th time (which we promised we wouldn't) and expect this to happen again a about a week's time when the stitches are removed....or put him out of his discomfort which makes me really sad I don't know if I can. Or I guess my other option is to just take him back home and leave it alone, but I'm worried it's going to lead to worse problems for him. Basically, I'm not sure there's really any good outcome. I wish there was a permanent fix for this. So so so hard. By the way, Chloe did email me back, but she basically gave me the same information that the 3 vets already told me. Baytril, metacam, lubricant, and surgery if nothing else. And clean cage. I just want you all to know that if this was the first time or 2nd that this had happened, I wouldn't even been considering putting him to sleep. But it's the 5th, and it's been a roller coaster month, and we need to draw the line somewhere right? It makes me cry just to think about it though. I just don't want something worse to happen, like his kidneys fail or bladder rupture if he can't pee...I wouldn't want him to suffer like that. And I feel like if I do the surgery again, we'll just be facing the same issue this time next week. It's just so hard cause he's still eating treats (but not much of his other food) and taking scratches and cuddles, and running around on the couch when we let him out. He is quite underweight as well, but he's always been a skinny degu. He did go from 200g in April, to 167g at the last check 10 days ago. I just wish there was a clear cut answer. |
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Post by michele23 on May 31, 2011 19:09:45 GMT
Here's the message I got from Chloe:
To have repeated penile prolapse is very strange, especially as it's happened to another of your degus in the past. This might suggest that there is something in the environment that could be triggering the prolapse. Common culprits for this are cotton-wool type bedding, that can get wrapped around the penis, or fine strands of similar material. I would recommend throwing out any bedding that could be causing this and switching to an alternative, like shredded paper or kitchen towel.
Is he currently on anti-inflams and antibiotics at the moment? I would strongly recommend both of these as part of his treatment, particularly the anti-inflams (recommend meloxicam at a dose rate of 0.000066 ml per g bodyweight, once daily for less than 10 days) to reduce swelling. The recommended antibiotics are Baytril 2.5% oral solution at a dose rate of 0.0001 ml per g bw, once daily for 7-10 days. Maintain lubrication with KY jelly (also is antibacterial), at least twice a day. Continue this treatment for 10 days before resorting to surgery as it will give time for the swelling to go down.
Is there anything else you can think of in the cage that could be triggering this? What substrate do you use?
Let me know how you get on,
Chloe
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Post by philbailey1806 on May 31, 2011 19:15:06 GMT
Wow! Is this girl a zoologist or what? lol. Sounds like she's a lot more knowledgeable than most vets!
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Post by kovu07 on May 31, 2011 19:16:55 GMT
Wow! Is this girl a zoologist or what? lol. Sounds like she's a lot more knowledgeable than most vets! Put simply, she is.  |
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