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Post by ettina on Mar 22, 2014 20:56:26 GMT
I've found out about a couple of 2 year old male degus looking for a home, and I'm thinking of adopting them, but I'd like some advice.
Firstly, I've never had degus before, but I have had rats. I understand degus need dust baths and have a different diet from rats, but apart from that, are there any other differences I need to know about?
Secondly, we live about 3 1/2 hours from the rescue center that has the degus. Any advice on how to travel with degus? (We live in Saskatchewan, by the way.)
Third, how long do degus live? If I get these 2 year olds, how much time can we expect to have with them?
Fourth, I really want pets who'll enjoy cuddling with me. If these guys aren't very tame, is 2 years old too late to really tame them? And how can I tell the difference between degus who are nervous around an unfamiliar person (or in a scary environment) versus degus who aren't very tame?
Thanks for any help.
Ettina
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Post by ilikedegus on Mar 22, 2014 21:39:49 GMT
Hello Ettina - welcome to the forum.
I kept rats long ago. I'd say degus are actually more intelligent and maybe a bit more self-willed than rats. Someone else may say different. They aren't such good climbers, and they seem to chew more (boy do they chew) perhaps because they like to taste everything!
Different diet, yes. You've probably read this, but degus are effectively diabetic; they don't eat any sugars at all in the wild so haven't got the ability to deal with it. There are lots of diet tips on this forum.
Travelling with degus - a chew-proof carrier! A cardboard box will not contain a degu for very long...
They live 7-8 years generally.
Assessing tameness is a difficult one. In a recent thread someone pointed out that any degu will be very wary/scared of a new person so don't assume that warning squeaks and hiding is a bad sign when you meet them at the rescue. You have obviously thought about this.
With time, many degus trust their owners and several of the members of this site have very friendly degus, some of whom do shoulders, laps, cleavages or bald heads. Some degus will cuddle, some will never be happy to be picked up. Part may be early treatment, part personality. If you are patient then most degus will become more friendly over time.
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Post by Maravilla on Mar 23, 2014 10:01:36 GMT
Hello, and welcome to the forum. Life expectancy is normally said to be 5-8 years. Some die earlier, some become older. A degu cage need to be as big as possible with full levels, lots of stuff to chew. For transporting them, I have different options at home. A wooden box and aquariums with a mesh cover. Degus normally sleep the whole time. I would not use plastic. This is not completely correct. Even hay contains sugar, all plants do. It is not even right that degus who get a huge amount of starch or sugar become diabetic. A lot of the old food (industrial things, pellets with lots of grains, colours, molasses etc.) did not kill the animals. Rats are omnivores, degus are herbivores. As for cuddling... one never knows. I cannot cuddle none of my degus. Right now I have 16. So: don't be disappointed if they don't want to do it. Actually, I have heard only of a small amount who really enjoy interacting with their owners. I think, rats are said to be tamer. To be honest: if having tame animals who you can cuddle is essential for you, I think degus are not the right animals. Even if they enjoy being handled at the rescue centre, it can easily be that they don't enjoy being handled by you. Some of my degus have problems with my husband but not with me and vice versa. So, you really don't know beforehand.
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Post by ettina on Mar 23, 2014 13:53:05 GMT
I'm not looking for long cuddles. My rats were all females, and female rats are hyper - I had just as much fun watching them run around while occasionally checking back with me.
But I do want a pet who trusts me. I want to know I can take them out of the cage without them panicking and trying to escape. It's kind of unsafe trying to give them time out of the cage if a careless movement might make them run. (I had a couple rats like that - took a lot of work to get them properly tamed, and before then I had to be super careful letting them play outside their cage. I was so glad when they finally started running to me instead of away from me when they got startled.)
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Post by Maravilla on Mar 23, 2014 14:35:25 GMT
Ok, I understand.
But what would you do if your degus never become tame? I have some, I can touch occasionally for a second or two, others just come to get a treat (and this was a long process). And the "worst" just run away when I approach the cage. This is one of the reasons why I don't offer free running time as I just cannot handle them as much as would be necessary in this situation.
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Post by moletteuk on Mar 23, 2014 19:57:48 GMT
I'm pretty close with my degus, but they still run away rather than towards me if they get startled. I have a permanent playpen where I interact with my degus, rather than let them free in the house.
Cage size is a big difference, they need a cage with three levels of 100 x 50cm (40x20") or the equivalent surface area.
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Post by ettina on Mar 23, 2014 20:26:57 GMT
I'm pretty close with my degus, but they still run away rather than towards me if they get startled. I have a permanent playpen where I interact with my degus, rather than let them free in the house. Cage size is a big difference, they need a cage with three levels of 100 x 50cm (40x20") or the equivalent surface area. Just out of curiosity, how many degus do you have? I was just wondering if it might be different with two degus as opposed to a larger number (like Maravilla's 16). I'm pretty sure if I'd ever had 16 pet rats, I wouldn't have had the time to get them all tamed. I found giving each rat individual playtime was really important - that and my cage size kept me to a maximum of 3 at any time.
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Post by ntg on Mar 23, 2014 20:48:22 GMT
Molette has 3 degus, I have four and similarly, I'm close to mine but they will always run into the cage or a hideyhole rather than to me if they get startled. As far as taming goes it varies a lot with the degus, within mine I have a range of personalities.
Gandalf is very withdrawn with most people but will happily fall asleep on my knee/stomach, but I can't stroke him.
Venk is very independent, he'll jump on my shoulder/in my hands on command and I can stroke his side now but he will spend most of his time happily just wandering around.
Smeg is my little sweetheart of the group, if I had a "cuddly" degu it'd be him, he'll sit on my lap, stomach or shoulder, happily wander on my hands and use my arm as a pillow by sleeping with his front paws on them, I can stroke him quite easily compared to Venk and Gandalf.
Pippin is the odd one, always the first to get spooked and run away, but also the bravest in terms of doing new things. He will happily chill out on my shoulder and use my head as a perch/lookout and will walk on my hands, same as the others. He'll also let me stroke him but a bit more than Smeg - I can get away with a quick scratch of his belly.
I will say this took a lot of time on my part, and each one learns and bonds at their own pace. Degus don't tend to do things to please their owners, it has to benefit them in some way before they deem it appropriate to do it, which is why treats are so important with training and maintenance of the training once you reach a stage you're happy with. If you were to always stop giving treats for them doing certain tasks then they'll see it as being beneath them.
Despite the training they have, I wouldn't have them free-range unless a playpen was involved, they get easily distracted!
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Post by Maravilla on Mar 24, 2014 7:55:25 GMT
It might be that my degus are not really tame because I have 16 (in different groups) at the moment. But for me it was far more important to give some more degus a good home than cuddle them. It might sound strange or enviable to you but here you would find a huge amount of degus just around the corner. I started with 5, but also 3 of those never became really tame. 2 were very interested and friendly but "don't touch me!". And I know a lot of other owners with small groups that are not that tame to enjoy cuddling with their owners. They enjoy taking food but not being touched.
It is completely up to you to decide whether to adopt degus and try to get them used to you or not. But it would not be fair to look for another home if it not works. Oh yes, there are a lot of people who try to get rid of these little monsters because they do not fulfil their expectations. And yes, sorry to tell you (and it is really not my intention to frighten you), if you decide to force a degu to do something he does not want to do, he can bite.
One of the shyest and most scared degus I have is a girl I got when she was 6 years old. Her mom and aunts were rescues of a huge animal hoarding case (several hundred degus). All she learned the first weeks was to feel fear and be afraid of every single human. Her sisters and brothers were the same. And also mommy and aunts (except from mom nobody else living here) never became tame. But on the other side, I have heard of babies from shy moms who were pretty tame.
If a degu becomes tame strongly depends on different things. It is not only a matter of time.
But another important thing to consider beforehand: do you have a vet around who knows about small animals and who knows about the needs of degus? He does not know all about them nor to be a specialist. But you would feel better if you knew you were not the first degu owner there.
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Post by jenowuk on Mar 25, 2014 6:51:08 GMT
Hi Ettina, I too moved from keeping rats (for 20 years) to keeping degus, mainly because I became heart broken as loosing my little friends so quickly, as rats only tend to live 3-4 years in captivity. I too always had very friendly relationships with my rats, lots of cuddles and interaction, and wanted this again with my goos. Our first goo Bob was very tame - we took him in at between 1-2 yrs of age as a rescue. We treated him the same way we did the rats in terms of taming - we'd talk to him, open his cage, and let him begin to make forays out to us, rather than put our hands into the cage to force the issue. We then got him a just weaned baby goo, who was the odd one out of his litter and Dad was beginning to pick on, and Bill was quickly introduced into our little family. Perhaps he learnt from Bob, but he was incredibly tame almost from day one. The pair of them would come out when we came home, run all over us, tire themselves out, then fall asleep on our knees, shoulders, curled into our sides...basically, wherever they were! They would happily stand still for scratching, or lift a paw to let you scratch their bellies. I miss them like crazy.....
After Bill died, we got Max and Sam to keep Bob company, but he was having none of it, and we ended up with two degu homes for a year until Bob passed away. Max and Sam are a little more self contained, and whilst they love being out, will happily eat from hand, and have no problem running all over us, they don't tend to settle down to sleep whilst out of their cage.
I think the big difference is that goos are prey animals, whereas rats are predators, so their fear / flight reaction is more finely honed, and they are more likely to run away at any hint of perceived danger. The only time this was ever an issue was if they got loose, they were slightly harder to catch.
My point? After a long ramble, I guess what I'm trying to say is that like rats, all goos are individual... Some are cuddly, some not so much...Most are friendly and interactive...and if you've had success taming rats, then I think you won't have any problems taming goos!
And is it worth it? You betcha:-)
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Post by ettina on Mar 26, 2014 15:09:20 GMT
I would like to reassure you guys that if I do adopt these degus, I will be making a lifetime commitment. As long as I'm capable of providing them with the care they need, I won't abandon them just because they're not cuddly.
We used to be a foster home for rescue cats, and one of our cats was a feral who spent all her time hiding in our basement. I got none of the rewards from her that I'm used to getting from a pet cat, but I still tried my best to make her comfortable. And then we managed to find her a nice farm to live on, where I'm sure she's much happier. (The farmer sees her only rarely, but she seems to be doing well, and she helps keep mice from eating his feed.) But if our only other option had been to let her die, we'd have kept her, even though she wasn't a friendly cuddly pet.
I feel that when you get a pet, you are making a commitment. Rehoming would be a last resort, done for the welfare of the animal rather than for my well-being. I could handle the basement-lurker cat, I can handle a timid degu.
Would I prefer a cuddly degu to one who doesn't like being touched? Definitely. Will I adopt a degu if I know in advance that this degu will never really like me? Probably not. But if I adopt a degu, I'll be committed to their well-being, no matter what they give in return.
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Post by ettina on Mar 26, 2014 15:24:45 GMT
Glad to hear it.
It's interesting what you say about rats being predators. When I got my rats, I was more used to cats, and I really noticed how much more skittish rats are than cats. I thought of rats as prey animals and didn't realize they could also be predators. I knew they liked meat, but I kind of assumed they scavenged. It's only recently, reading research literature, that I realized rats also hunt.
I don't know if it's the predator-prey spectrum here, though. My guess is that it's more because rats have been kept by humans longer. Most pet rats are descended from laboratory strains, that have been extensively bred to have certain traits. (My first two I suspect came from a cancer-prone strain.)
Even if you aren't deliberately selecting for friendliness, animals bred in a captive environment tend to get tamer with each generation. Partly because of lack of selection against tameness (a wild rodent who isn't afraid of a potential predator won't live very long), but also because the least tame animals are often at a disadvantage due to increased stress and spending time hiding or trying to escape. And I think many labs have selected for tameness in rats strains, because wild rats bite when cornered.
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